BONUS EPISODE: The Crash of the USS McCain
Added 2024-10-23 09:53:17 +0000 UTCLast chance to get tickets for our show this weekend in Belfast:
https://www.universe.com/events/lions-led-by-donkeys-podcast-live-in-belfast-tickets-83V5QD
Can't make it to Belfast? We're streaming the show! Get your tickets here:
Check out our merch store!
The US Navy attempts to do a quick update for their aging fleet of ships, ending with a system that sailors don't know how to use, the Navy doesn't know how to manage, and a mysterious, literal, big red button.
Sources:
https://www.navytimes.com/news/your-navy/2019/08/06/new-report-blames-big-navy-for-fatal-collision/
https://features.propublica.org/navy-accidents/us-navy-crashes-japan-cause-mccain/
https://news.usni.org/2018/08/21/35947
https://safety4sea.com/cm-uss-john-s-mccain-collision-a-prime-example-of-poor-oversight/
Comments
Yup. He provisioned a lot of prostitutes. Ships began to bump into shit not long after he got busted, which plays into a theory I have about Navy morale...
Scott Kean
2024-11-19 08:14:02 +0000 UTCYou don’t want to know how many military people mindlessly repeat Silicon Valley buzzwords with zero understanding of any of the underlying concepts or technologies.
Matt
2024-11-07 19:57:02 +0000 UTCThis one was absolutely maddening. I already have lost a great deal of faith in the systems that are in charge of everything and this one didn’t help. Essentially the navy said, “We fucked up and will now fuck those in charge of this ship to death just because.” 😂
3 Toed Jim
2024-10-30 12:22:53 +0000 UTCThe Seventh Fleet is the one that had the Fat Leonard Scandal too right?
Jonathan Bastow
2024-10-30 02:01:52 +0000 UTCI served with James Mccain and its wild af to think i shared the same chow with a dude whos grandpa had a ship named after him which was in turn about as effective as his father....small world, hope James ok, decent Marine and human being.
Jonathan Sutter
2024-10-27 19:00:09 +0000 UTCLove the Zoo Crew. Someday I would love for them to do a bonus series where they have to dive head first into the fuckery that is the Bravo Two Zero mission. Three contradictory first-hand accounts published, two of which were made into movies, and decades of back and forth arguments. I don't know why, but it'd be fun to put these guys in a historical detective scenario.
Spaghetti
2024-10-27 06:18:35 +0000 UTCGod now this was an infuriating one
Eric Johnson
2024-10-25 12:36:29 +0000 UTCThe only answer to the question from the legion is Eugene Bullard. That dude fucking rocked.
Chris Bandoian
2024-10-25 10:12:20 +0000 UTCMy cousin through marriage is sitting in Leavenworth. I'm of the opinion that he is guilty as hell but also of the opinion that the people that started the practice that they charged him with did not get the serious sentence, he was just the neqest guy, the one who threatened to go outside the chain of command, and the one that the unit didn't want to protect. But he still engaged in the series of war crimes, along with his unit.
Alive Or Trees
2024-10-25 01:23:53 +0000 UTCLol, I love these boat episodes. I worked on Nav equipment on one of these ships ....way before contractors were forced to do my job (wtf?) and way before the touchscreen. My first thought when that thing was described was "man, my captain would have immediately ordered that shit tagged out forever." That is not sailor proof equipment.
Scott Kean
2024-10-24 22:19:31 +0000 UTCThis whole story reminds me of when a private ambulance company I once worked for gave us a hydraulic power stretcher, didn't show us how it worked because "we have calls holding" and unsurprisingly the thing ended up flipping. Thankfully the patient was not injured but I was pissed and thankfully no longer work for said company.
Rosemary S Callahan Gray
2024-10-24 18:01:15 +0000 UTCI feel like I'm a reasonably competent person and this feels like how dangerous it is to operate a newer car that has next to no buttons and only touch screens. I am a DANGER to everyone trying to drive one.
Alexandria London
2024-10-24 17:56:01 +0000 UTC“Elon: If we replace the crew with Tesla robots we can improve moral on the ship to 100%”
William Shackelford
2024-10-24 15:03:19 +0000 UTCI need some John Paul Jones episodes stat!
William Shackelford
2024-10-24 15:01:19 +0000 UTCI was a fast attack guy and we were always told that you folks on targets got much better duty rotations that we did. We were also 3 section, lucky if we got 4 section for those few months between a new guy arriving and a senior guy rotating out. P/S duty I fortunately have never had to do, but some of the other guys in engineering did. Being an MM we had plenty of people, but the reactor operators were always down a person or two.
Eric A Gentzler
2024-10-24 11:29:23 +0000 UTCThe navy concentrates all of its training on the nuclear personnel, and nobody else.
Eric A Gentzler
2024-10-24 11:24:11 +0000 UTCYou wouldn't take such a slapdash approach with the software for, say, a scientific research satellite (notably lacking 5 inch guns or harpoon missiles)
trashdo
2024-10-24 10:43:17 +0000 UTCNext boat episode should be the story of the Storozhevoy and the good ol soviet choas that ensues
Colt
2024-10-24 04:15:49 +0000 UTCAs a sailor (though, thankfully not USN), your big dumb boat episodes are a highlight of my week whenever they come out! Some other navy/boat topics I’d like to hear you cover are the Coppermine Expedition (all-time Royal Navy donkey Sir John Franklin leads an ill-prepared overland expedition that, in true Royal Navy fashion, ends in cannibalism. Everything gets blamed on their dead French Canadian guide. This will not be the last time Sir John Franklin does something similar) and the life of John Paul Jones, Absolute Madman.
Paloma Alcala
2024-10-23 20:52:52 +0000 UTCThe alternate title could be: "Why Touchscreens Are Bad Way to Manage Any Vehicle: I'm looking at you, Elon."
Doug King
2024-10-23 20:17:19 +0000 UTCTrump couldn’t resist any moment to damage a McCain whenever present.
William Shackelford
2024-10-23 18:14:27 +0000 UTCThis is so on brand for the navy. When I was in Submarine sonar A school we got trained 90% on the newest system. My boat however had all original green and black screen old school shit. So I basically had to learn everything from scratch. The only worse reaction I've seen from the navy was the USS SF crash the led to a lot of restrictions on sonar. The S.F. crashed into an underwater mountain which famously don't make noise.
John the penguin
2024-10-23 17:38:28 +0000 UTCI think I'm going to go listen to all the Big Dumb Boat episodes I can find in the catalogue.
sistertotherain9
2024-10-23 15:33:05 +0000 UTCnominative determinism perhaps?
oa
2024-10-23 14:08:14 +0000 UTCThe US Navy is all in on NFTs; No Fucking Training
Noblesse Oblahaj
2024-10-23 14:05:23 +0000 UTCJesus… if I could ever be a guest on the show, I would tell you some stories about my experiences working on modular C-130 modifications. I was both in the Air Force and a defense contractor. But I like my life, and I don't want to disappear to a black site and never see my family again. Thank you, NDAs!
I_like_planes_and_cities
2024-10-23 13:36:46 +0000 UTCOh my god, it sounds like the entire navy got conned by some silicone valley grift with the smartship program. I bet they're already planning AI integration before even knowing what an AI would be useful for - we are SO COOKED if we ever get into a major war. We are so screwed. I'm talkin "mk.14 torpedo" levels of boned.
Brandon P
2024-10-23 13:19:04 +0000 UTCEvery ship is a ship of theses when every crewman can theoretically pilot it
Noblesse Oblahaj
2024-10-23 13:17:36 +0000 UTCHooray! A big dumb boat! My favorite.
Thomas Layton
2024-10-23 12:58:26 +0000 UTCI love that something named McCain crashed
Noblesse Oblahaj
2024-10-23 12:43:35 +0000 UTCJoe was that bit in RvB with the tank that has 6 pedals
nughh
2024-10-23 12:14:10 +0000 UTCLol! The Danzig and Leo Major episodes are the ones that got me hooked on LLBD. I’m also pretty sure because of those episodes my neighbours think I’m crazy… literally laughing out loud as I’m walking the dog 🤷🏼♀️
🌺 Nyc 🌺
2024-10-23 11:49:15 +0000 UTCHaven't listened yet, but 1-2 Army vets talking about a Navy fuckup? This is going to be good. But for real, I was stationed on a different destroyer out of Yoko when this happened. If I had reenlisted, I would have BEEN on the McCain when this happened. I'm curious to see what you guys put together on this, and how it compares to what we were told at the time. I'll try to follow-up after I listen. Edit: >So, regarding the functioning of the Big Red Button: on the old system (which is what my ship had), the Big Red Button DID function as the Sailors described, i.e. both the bridge & aft steering buttons transferred control to aft steering. >My memories of what we were told at the time are a little fuzzy (as I was *also* a deeply sleep-deprived 7th Fleet Sailor on deployment), but i recall the general buzz vibe being that the bridge crew was undertrained [degragatory]. To no one's surprise, nothing was mentioned at the time that they had no way of beinbeing properly trained. >Damn, an 8-section duty rotation? We didnt even get that in port, mych less underway. We were doing really good to get UP to 4-section. Most workcenters were on 3-section 99% of the time, ocassionally dropping down to port-and-starboard. (To translate all of that to normal-people speak, normal watch rotation on my ship was 5 hours on, 10 hours off. Here's the thithing that "10 off" means 10 hours off of watch, not necessarily off of work. Maintaintence still has to get done, so if your time off of watch was between 7am and 4:30pm(ish), you were still working. Add that together with the watch roation and you usually only get about 4-5 hours free (to sleep, do laundry, work on mandatory qualifications, pretend to be a normal human being, etc.), and every third day works about to be 20-hour workday.) >The Mental Health office at Medical in Yokosuka was tiny, tucked away in a corner of the base, and perpetually overwhelmed. Oh and your chain of command could just tell you no if you wanted to go. On top of that, just talking to Mental Health hurt your chances of promotion, or getting selected for special trainings. The general assumtion was that if you went to Mental Health, you were going to be med sepped within the year. >Obligatory correction to Joe's pronunciation (because we all know how much he loves that): The "u" in Yokosuka is effectively silent. Pronunciation is something more like "Yo ko skah".
Joseph Pulfer
2024-10-23 11:26:41 +0000 UTCMarines with highly technical jobs are the same as the sailors and soldiers believing in ghosts and gremlins. Go ask anyone who did communications for a job.
Matt
2024-10-23 11:18:49 +0000 UTC
![개성인쥬스[pingkypen]](https://nokimo.com/istorage/106895.jpg)
