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Episode 181: US Media's 5 Most Popular Revisionist Tropes About the Iraq and Vietnam Wars

"Charting a different course in the Vietnam War to fewer deaths and a better end," muses a book review in the Washington Post. "The Vietnam War was begun in good faith, by decent people," a Ken Burns PBS documentary tells us. "The Iraq War Reconsidered," reads a headline from The Atlantic.

Often, especially when an anniversary of a U.S. invasion or withdrawal rolls around, we're told that the devastation wrought by the US war machine was complicated, flawed, but ultimately necessary if not beneficial. Sure, the United States has killed millions, destabilized power structures, wrecked communities and economies, lied about the reasons for doing it all, and drawn the ire of people throughout the world. But, in hindsight, many in U.S. media insists, a horrible act of war from a world superpower wasn't an unequivocal, deliberate, and needless crime against humanity, but somewhere between a misunderstood righteous cause and a bumbling, good faith mistake motivated by humanitarian concerns.

An ideological system of reassurance therefore emerges. Once wars are broadly viewed as either wrong or a quote-unquote "failure" in the popular imagination — as in the case of Vietnam and Iraq — a cottage industry of punditry and pseudo-history emerges in the subsequent years designed to soothe the egos of elites and muddy the waters of both memory and reality for casual media consumers.

Put another way: we all see a dead body on the floor, no one can doubt this. No one can reasonably argue the destruction of Vietnam and Iraq didn't happen. So, this cottage industry springs into action, on behalf of those that caused the death, working to get the guilty party a charge of third degree manslaughter rather than murder. It was an accident, they were mistaken, they had bad intelligence, they were driven by concerns for freedom and human rights.

After all, those who destroyed Vietnam remained in power well into the 2000s. And those who destroyed Iraq currently run our major publications, universities, nonprofits, and think tanks. They still even run the country itself. So the incentive to make sure they all plead guilty to third degree manslaughter rather than first degree murder is tremendous, otherwise, we’re just a country led by war criminals — and this simply cannot be. We need absolution. We must remain, when all is said and done, innocent.

On this week's episode, we’ll explore the war revisionism industry, breaking down five ways in which media seek to sanitize and justify even the most notoriously unpopular and horrific U.S.-led and backed wars — namely Vietnam and Iraq — as unpleasant, imperfect, mistaken, but ultimately incidental byproducts of a noble and righteous empire that, above all, meant well.

Our guest is The Intercept's Jon Schwarz.

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Guest

Jon Schwarz (@schwarz) is a senior writer for The Intercept. Jon's amazing archive of commentary, analysis and criticism can be found at A Tiny Revolution.

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Show Notes

The Architects of the Iraq War: Where Are They Now?

Jon Schwarz | March 15, 2023 | The Intercept

US Media's Iraq War Pushers 20 Years On: Where Are They Now? Rich and Influential.

Adam Johnson | March 17, 2023 | The Real News Network

20 Years On, a Question Lingers About Iraq: Why Did the U.S. Invade?

Max Fisher | March 18, 2023 | The New York Times

Iraq War Apologism Is Alive and Well

Branko Marcetic | March 21, 2023 | Jacobin

Whatever They Say Now, America’s Political and Media Elites Overwhelmingly Supported the Iraq War

Joe Renouard | March 21, 2023 | ZNetwork

​​A Known and Unknown War

Michael Brenes | March 20, 2023 | Contingent Magazine

How to Write an Iraq War Apologia

Elspeth Reeve | March 20, 2013 | The Atlantic

All History Is Revisionist History

James M. Banner, Jr. | Summer 2022 | Humanities

20 Years After U.S. Invasion, Iraq Is a Freer Place, but Not a Hopeful One

Alissa J. Rubin | March 18, 2023 | The New York Times

Penance Before Absolution

Charles P. Pierce | Mach 20, 2013 | Esquire

Mistakes, Excuses and Painful Lessons From the Iraq War

Ezra Klein | March 19, 2013 | Bloomberg

Revisionism as a Substitute for Victory

Mark Atwood Lawrence | July 6, 2018 | The Common Reader

Vietnam Revisionism and the Ugly American

Mark Atwood Lawrence | June 5, 2018 | Lawfare

Max Boot’s Vietnam

John Ganz | February 20, 2018 | The Baffler

Another Warmonger Rewarded for Being Wrong on Iraq War

Adam Johnson | February 1, 2018 | FAIR

Why Are We in the Middle East?

Richard Beck | Fall 2016 | n+1

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Transcript

For a full transcript of this episode, go here. You can find transcripts of past episodes and News Briefs here.

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Citations Merch

Remember that the Citations Needed merch store is open! Please consider further supporting the show by picking up a t-shirt, tank top, sweatshirt, tote or coffee mug for yourself or your favorite Citations fan (or everyone you know!).

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Credits

Senior Producer: Florence Barrau-Adams

Producer: Julianne Tveten

Production Assistant: Trendel Lightburn

Newsletter: Marco Cartolano

Transcription: Morgan McAslan

Music: Grandaddy

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Episode 181: US Media's 5 Most Popular Revisionist Tropes About the Iraq and Vietnam Wars

Comments

30 minutes in and i need to take a break because i'm getting so pissed off and just wanna start shouting about this in ppls faces at work lol. the way anyone could ever say or buy that decimating a country through every means possible is 'spreading democracy' just makes me see RED!!!

natfos 💌

Much appreciated coverage, guys. So you reminded me I called out some of my Republican ghoul colleagues at work some time after the Iraq war started, but it made no difference to their (pre-closed) minds, obviously. One idiot played stupid, "Mark, you couldn't have known there were no WMDs in Iraq at the time!! Literally NO ONE in the world knew that!" I stated clearly that (a) US Marine & UN Weapons Inspector Scott Ritter was sharing the no WMDs facts at the time, & (b) I knew as a history teacher that the purported reasons for the US entry into the Spanish American War, earlier US-Mexico war, Gulf of Tonkin fake incident to start US entry to Vietnam were all faked, etc.. Might as well have been speaking Esperanto!! (This dude was a dummy who literally called Obama a lefty "Socialist" in debates for the HS students during the 08 & 12 election shows.) I talked to his zombie buddy later, our conversation ended with him saying, Well, look, everything is going to be OKAY, anyway!! Meaning okay for HIS white, Catholic NorCal family. The people of Iraq & the region were entirely forgotten, nonexistent-- I guess like Golda Meir more than once said there simply "were no Palestinian people" in 1948.

Mark Schneider

😆

Gillian Rosheuvel

And an enlightened corporate underwriter, Bank of America!

Shawn A

Great job guys. Jon's closing remarks were biting (and fantastic)!

This is also timely in that Kissinger is about to turn 100 in a couple weeks. Talk about someone who hasn't had the decency to shuffle off his mortal coil...

Lizbeth Kimble

Re the Ken Burns Vietnam documentary...I mean what did we expect from something funded by the Koch brothers

Gillian Rosheuvel

when citations needed drops on the clock and i can use the transcript to read it >>>

natfos 💌


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