(Wip) and important message
Added 2020-01-23 11:03:06 +0000 UTCI leave this (work in progress) and I wanted to say that I’m sorry if I bothered you with my last pages of the comic. Many people told me I was insensitive, because I’m touching a very delicate topic like sexual assault. That was not my intention, so I wanted to explain it. I never mentioned it because I didn’t want to talk about such a delicate thing. I’m no one to talk about it. I’m sorry if you felt bad because of me.
Comments
I thought you handled it very well.
Samantha Mingus
2020-01-26 00:56:04 +0000 UTCThis wip is like a sequel to that dtiys ... but Az got a haircut in the meantime!
M Aidan
2020-01-24 11:57:26 +0000 UTCDon’t be sad, you handled it very sensitively. ❤️
ScrapHeapChallenge
2020-01-23 23:35:15 +0000 UTCThat was my thought. He was being mean and telling Aziraphale he would fall for loving someone besides God, or maybe for kissing I guess, so why on earth (or I guess in heaven) would he do something himself that would cause him to fall like he believes would happen to Aziraphale? Totally nonsensical when taken in context with the previous installments.
Kaiannanthi
2020-01-23 21:06:57 +0000 UTCI agree with this. I also want to definitely state there is a major difference between a creator implying something and a consumer inferring something, which is absolutely what occurred here.
Kaiannanthi
2020-01-23 20:49:11 +0000 UTCWell, this seems to have blown up. I’d like to request that everyone take a few steps back and think about what’s happening here, what year it is and where we want to go from here. The core of this issue is that art is, at times, supposed to challenge us with strong issues and emotions. This is counterbalanced by the fact that everyone has a right to decide their media diet. Negotiating between these two often opposing forces is tricky. So let’s look at some basic concepts: direct depiction vs implied, trigger warnings vs content warnings, author vs reader responsibility, the healing power of reading trauma and how to move forward. First, yes, sexual assault/ physical assualt/ emotional assualt what have you are all real problem that many people have face. I know I have. It’s not silly for people to want to consume content that contains it in places and at times they feel emotionally ready for it, even if they were victims of it. That being said, Alice did not depict the core thing that Gabriel did to Aziraphale. It’s implied. And that changes things a lot. Content creators in 2020 (on average) know that graphic, direct depictions of rape, assualt or what have you should be thrown up behind trigger warnings. Some people pre-tag the whole work, others tag the chapter/ page it’s in to allow for better storytelling. This is a great improvement over 2010. In this decade, we seem to be debating if implied depictions of things like rape need content warnings. Not flashbacks, not “fade to black moments”. And that’s a harder nut to crack. The first comparison that comes to mind is the scenes in Forrest Gump (PG-13), in which Jenny throws rocks at her father’s house and then earlier prays to be made into a bird so she could “fly, far far away”, before ultimately being taken away by child services. Watching that, as a teen (who was being physically abused by their parents at the time), I knew 100% what those scenes meant. It’s beautifully dubious, since there is also the suggestion that she might have been a victim of incest as well. All we as the audience know for sure is, Jenny is abused without ever having to be exposed to the scene of an adult man abusing a preteen. Does that movie need a content warning for those scenes? Would you, if you were recommending that movie to a friend who has never watched it before warn them about it? Would the PG-13 label be enough? I feel like I’d be more likely to warn someone that is contains direct depictions of war and drug abuse, than the implied abuse. I’ve certainly had media tear me apart before. And it’s funny how, at least to me, it’s rarely the graphic depictions of assault that hurt the most. In a way, it’s clinical. It’s happening, you know it’s bad, then end. It’s often the quiet moments, when the character is alone or with only a trusted friend and that they are struggling to hold their life together (or even their own mental image of themselves) that sometimes means I need to take a break. [For a more recent example, Legend of Korra, folks. The scene of her torture, I doubt many people paused. The subsequent depictions of her PTSD? That is what tends to kill me.] There is nothing toxic about depicting characters struggling. It’s the core of most stories really. And I would wager to say, that you all don’t want that to stop. Again, going back to Forrest Gump, Jenny praying to be taken away from her abusive house is not something that is “triggering”. It’s something that a highly accurate depiction of sensitive content. The difference between the two is critical because we cannot lump everything under the first tag. It belittles the very real healing process many of us are going through while also devalving the idea of a “trigger”. When the term was originally hitting pop culture, the idea was very direct. A sight, sound, touch, taste that directly causes an immediate flashback/ panic. The cliche was fireworks triggering vets. Now a days, we have expanded it out. A lot. We admit that there is a wide range of responses between an intensive flashback and no reaction. And that’s good! People don’t just magically get over trauma. But, if you imagine the healing process there has to be a line in which someone can say “Well, this makes me uncomfortable, but I don’t need to be warned about it.” Drawing that line is hard and the responsibility is on both creators and audiences. I’ve had moments in my life where I knew I needed to stick to safe, known media because honestly I was just too raw to deal with even the tiniest amount of bad vibes would probably end up with me having a very, very bad night. Should Alice have put up a content warning for this chapter? You know, in my opinion, no. If this was playing on the TV, so far we are in “PG” land. 100%. This would be on par with watching Rapunzel. And let’s be honest, ‘Mother Knows Best’ hits the same intensity as this scene for many people. The direct belittlement of the main character, the gas lighting, the raging narcissist of a villain in the guise of a parental figure….it’s a lot of hooks for people with that abuse. Even knowing the basic story of Rapunzel (public domain and all) before watching this movie didn’t prevent me from having a bit of a reaction to the Mother Gothel character. Content warnings can’t negate our own feelings after all. Those are my reactions and I have to take responsibility for them. It’s not my fault that I have them, but it is my responsibility. I am very sorry for anyone who had to go through something that made this chapter (or the previous ones) hit them the same way I’ve been hit by the listed media above. You didn’t deserve that happening to you. No one does. But content creators didn’t do this to you and the stories add value to society. Those same stories might actually help you later. I’ve found the Good Omens fandom to be highly therapeutic because content creators have made stories like this, like Repossession, like the Tri-Phasic Model of Trauma. I get to see characters I love unconditionally and value struggle with things I did. I get to love them, root for them, cry for them without a single shred of doubt and that helps me reflect on what happened to me (something I often add blame to because, well that’s often how it works right- when you are powerless you blame yourself.) Granted, I’m a half decade to decade out and have had lots of therapy at this point. But I would think the world a worse place if someone had decided not to make the stuff I love at 28 because at 18 I was being severely abused and they didn’t want to trigger me. [Honestly, I was already reading stuff like this at 18 because….I needed it. Fan-fic kept me going in my teens. I got to see characters go through hell, like I was at the time, and come out messed up. And then loved. And respected. And allowed to heal. It was like a promise: if this can happen to them, it can happen to you. And to those authors: thank you. You gave me hope in a world that didn’t care about me. I told literal adults, mandated reporters, I was being abused and they didn’t care. You, you, you nameless people of the internet, told me-through those characters we both loved-that I had value and that one day someone could love me.] I respect other people might have different opinions and I wouldn’t be shocked to see more content warnings in the future. I don’t think it would hurt. But I think before we criticize, we need to think about what solution we want. Would an “agnst” tag have been enough? “Implied assault”? Could someone have still fallen through the cracks and been hurt even with those tags? Where would you have want to have seen it: at the start or the end? If the former, can you accept not all creators start out with a plan and might have to tag as thing occur? Most fan-fic is a work of love, with some people getting a bit of cash for it and very, very few being able to make a job out of it. It’s hard to plan everything 100% even if you are being paid for it as well. And most of all, can you remember that you make mistakes too? I was 22 once and I like to think I was very empathetic at that age; I wanted to be kind in and to a world that had been exceedingly cruel to me. I still made mistakes; you can’t avoid that. I still didn’t know as much as I do now. I hope in 6 more years I will have learned many more ways to be kind that I didn’t at 28. I don’t think that made me a bad person at 22 or even now, because I will learn more in the future. That just makes me human. This turned into an essay and for that, I don’t apologize. This is a very serious topic. But I hope this adds to the discourse a little bit.
Fern with Googley Eyes
2020-01-23 20:16:43 +0000 UTCThis morning when I saw those asks on Tumblr I was a bit sad, but they made me reflect about the whole thing. Yes, I wanted to keep a bit of mystery, I didn’t want to say everything. I wanted to see the story from Raphael’s point of view. Then I had to say there wasn’t rape. I didn’t blame people writing me to add the warning. I added it to the last chapter. You’re right. I’m not blaming you. I understand your point of view and I respect it. The story is going on in my head, and I decide step by step. So, at the beginning, I didn’t know exactly what happened, as I said. After that, I decided: no rape, but I wanted to keep the secret. That’s all, but now I understood everything. Next chapter will come soon and I really hope you all will appreciate it in its simplicity like all the story. I’m only trying to make people have a bit of fun, even if I’m doing angsty comics, but that’s my work. I’m sorry for everything.
Alice Rovai
2020-01-23 19:34:21 +0000 UTCTo Alice: I love your art, which is why I signed up on this subscription. But, I was one of the people upset by the lack of warning, and how you initially handled the concerns about content. I see that you've directly now said that there was no rape, but your initial comments on tumblr were, to paraphrase, 'I don't even know what happened X)' and that glib attitude seemed dismissive. You also said about Gabriel, "I fear he touched more than his hair." Your comments, combined with the words in the comic "He forced me" definitely did seem to allude to sexual assault, which you acknowledged, and when people asked you directly about it, you kept dodging the question, because you wanted to protect the ambiguity of the story. Now, you've stated that you didn't want to hurt people and you have warning up, which are all good things. To the other commentors: I don't think that people who posted anonymously online should have to give their names, because I don't think rape victims owe anyone their names. I also don't think people were especially rude, but I do think they had criticisms, and criticism does not equal hate. Just because some people didn't find it upsetting doesn't mean that the people who DID find it upsetting are wrong. It is absolutely a personal thing, and all people were asking for was kindness and understanding, which usually isn't too hard to find in the good omens fandom. I don't think asking for sensitivity, especially in this day and age when we have so many ways to make a kinder, softer world, is unreasonable. I think Alice did the right thing in making the choice to do those things. But, if I'm not welcome as a subscriber because I had a criticism of one particular piece of her art (which, Alice did say people that feel this way should just unfollow) seems reductive.
GoodbyeVanny
2020-01-23 19:21:28 +0000 UTCI don’t think you need to apologise for what you draw. I read it and thought it could go either way but you probably did not mean sexual assault as most victims of that do not immediately wish to have sex with someone else! I think people over-reacted and put words in your mouth there. If you wanted to be very thoughtful to easily triggered people you could warn that there are ambiguous references to trauma in this part and people can decide if they want to read it and you can keep being you! 😍
Ariana Lipman
2020-01-23 18:05:49 +0000 UTCYes, I understand it. Gabriel didn’t rape Aziraphale, but I wanted to keep the story vague. I didn’t expect the reactions so I didn’t think of put a warning: my fault.
Alice Rovai
2020-01-23 15:55:39 +0000 UTCI didn't see it at first but then some of my friends were very bothered by it. Not because people can't use sexual assault in a story but because they didn't have the warning to avoid it. 💕
gem de arte
2020-01-23 15:52:17 +0000 UTCI'm so sorry you're getting flack. I love the story so far. I didn't really take it as sexual assault (though I can see how some could have taken it that way), but it didn't strike me as sexual assault mostly because angels are foreign to sex except for Crowley and Aziraphale it seems. I took it more that Gabriel forced Aziraphale to feel pain (hit him, etc...) because in the previous panels Gabriel had said Aziraphale shouldn't be able to feel pain. I'm really sorry you're being bombarded even when the story isn't finished...
commodorecliche
2020-01-23 14:43:39 +0000 UTCSo, I didn't think of it that way either. I love your comic, please don't Stopp!
Sarah Marino
2020-01-23 13:41:16 +0000 UTCHey, I was sexually assaulted and I didn't get that vibe at all from your comic
Flywolf
2020-01-23 13:33:26 +0000 UTC
