Buffy the Vampire Slayer || 6x13 || Discussion

I think it still works in that today's audiences tend not to take them very seriously in the beginning - they might not be laughing at them, but they usually don't perceive them as a legit threat. And then this episode comes along...

Jamie Morgan

This is the episode where I can finally comment on how the brilliance of season 6 is (mostly) lost to time. Today, The Trio makes people uncomfortable from the beginning, but back when this aired, they were pure comedic relief. We spent the first half of this season laughing at all their jokes about turning women into sex slaves, and that moment when Katrina yells, "This isn't some fantasy! It's rape!" it was like the show was calling us out for laughing at it all along. It was a novel idea at the time, and it was absolutely brilliant writing. It's a good thing that society has evolved so that the impact is lost, but it does tend to make it so youngins watching it today don't really get how awesome it was.

Janel Davis

Ooooooooooooohhhhh…. Yeah. That makes more sense 😭

Brandon Scott

"shipper glasses" is the term ahhaha

Olivia Hester

You realise I said "if" she is messed up. The fact that possibly she came back wrong could affect her in many ways unknown to those who are first time viewers. You read a lot more into my comment that was there.

Oxmustube

The fact is, they were permitted to go further in this season because they were on UPN, a brand new network looking to make a mark.

Thom Purdy

I think the whole idea with the "cerebral suppressor" was not to turn a women into a perfect version of herself, rather to make her susceptible to suggestions, very much like hypnotism AND that Warren chose Katrina as his first, and possibly, only target speaks to his self esteem and megalomania. Katrina dumped him and shamed him. Unlike (supposedly) Jonathan and Andrew, he actually was successful with women, at least with a very significant one, and she rejected him. This was about power, building another robot wouldn't have given him that.

Ashtara Levin

you defiantly had … “stripper glasses”…did I hear you right? Lol. It’s not just you. The number of people who seem genuinely surprised when Spike behaves in a way that is completely in line with who he is has always astounded me. If you go back a few episodes after and remember him calling after her as she walked away and assuring her that he was the only one there for her and they she didn’t have anyone else in her life …. You have to know that is textbook, narcissistic right out of the domestic abuser playbook, yeah?

Brandon Scott

I really can't wrap my mind around Warren, other than him being a total creep. So, last season we were introduced to Warren as the creator of the robot, April. He thought he would love a "perfect" woman who would cater to his every need, but she got boring and he realized he preferred the relationship and interraction of a real woman. But now, in this episode, he builds a device that effectively turns real women into robots. Dude.....JUST BUILD ANOTHER ROBOT if that's what you want.

Steve Quast

Of course she has agency, what are you talking about!!! Let’s stop this narrative that when women are going through something and vulnerable they have no control over their actions.. she wanted it, period. We always have our agency, we’re people not objects, unless we’re deprived of it like willow did to Tara or warren to kathrina taking their agency away. That scene at bronze is uncomfortable but not for what you’re trying to make it out to be, of course you’re entitled to your opinion and if you feel that’s what happened then okay, but objectively speaking.. that’s not what happened, buffy wanted it, that’s why it’s so uncomfortable to watch, because she literally had sex while looking at her friends and that’s kinda fucked up and a little sick, and she didn’t stop it, buffy has gone dark. Even tho, I’m not judging, I can totally see the thrill of getting away with it while doing it right in front their noses, as spike puts it. People are forcing this parallel between spike and warren, y’all the parallel in this episode is between buffy and warren and couldn’t be made more clear with the dream sequence. Spike is her kathrina, he turns into her, she stakes him and kills kathrina (in the dream), spike is submissive, and we know that because he calls himself a willing slave when he’s singing to buffy, just like kathrina was with warren, only she wasn’t willing.

Marty

The police found her body in the river. She could have jumped off a bridge.

Oxmustube

Spike touching Buffy in the bar, her asking him to stop but letting him was an interresting parallel with Warren and Katrina. Of course Katrina is controlled, but if Buffy is messed up, does she have agency over her actions? The Buffyverse goes to very uncomfortable places sometimes.

Oxmustube

Spike and buffy are toxic. This is her self destructive behavior and spike has always been trying to separate her from her friends so he can have her to himself. They literally beat each other up to make the sex more exciting. (also the handcuffs and "do you trust me?" was a prompt so he could tie her up for more sex but she didn't trust him to give him the power. In the dream she had Katrina and Spike both tied up, showing that she has the power over and trust from both the people she's supposed to protect (katrina) and spike. She thinks shes killed katrina and knows she taking advantage of spike so she feels like she is abusing both of those "relationships" and feels guilty, so thats why she immediately knew she was gonna turn herself in. Another reason Buffy went to the police immediately is for the same reason she cried at the end; she believes she deserves to be punished. I personally think it is the effects of being pulled out of heaven. I feel like a part of her thinks she didn't deserve heaven and that's why she couldn't stay. I think it's also because she doesn't wanna go the Faith route.

Mikayla Welker

I don't think the way Spike was acting was out of character at all. He's always tried to use everything he could to draw her in and now that the knows "she came back different" he instantly used it to his advantage by telling her she is less than human and that she belongs in the darkness with him. He knows the more he isolates Buffy from her friends, the more he can sink his teeth into her and get what he wants.

Charisma

I am very glad that most of the show is not Season 6, but man do I love Season 6. And it lands because of how much time we have spent with these characters, leading to the investment we have in what is happening with them.

I can finally say without spoilers that everyone looks at me funny when I say the Trio are the only Buffy villains to ever give me nightmares until around this point. Because I'm not scared of monsters, but I've had plenty of reasons to be afraid of that kind of entitled, enraged, violent incel who suddenly gets a little power. People have all sorts of thoughts, but I think in the season about "adult real world problems" having villains who seem like harmless, idiot nerds but are actually incredibly dangerous, volatile misogynists with god complexes was an interesting move.

Launa Sorensen