Nekomonogatari Episode 4 Reaction
Added 2025-05-18 15:07:26 +0000 UTCStarting the arc with "I love her" and ending it with "I don't love her" is poetic.
Comments
"Everyone has things they can't say even when they want to, don't they, Araragi-kun?" I've always interpreted this as Oshino talking about himself, admitting that "goodbye" is something he wants to say, but can't. They briefly show the fence while he's saying the line and everything. -- Regarding Araragi's pre-battle conversation with Oshino, I believe he's getting in character for the confrontation. He has no way to attack her with the sword, so he comes up with a plan to conceal it, but that plan relies on her attacking him in a reckless way. There are two flaws here: she's too clever to do that, and she's just not that angry at him specifically. What he needs to do is make her as angry as possible and direct all the anger at him, so the idea is to reject her unequivocally and force her to feel betrayed by him. He wants to call out all her flaws, deny her victimhood, and then say he hates her, so she'll abandon any hopes that he would come to her rescue, and then she'll attack him without caution. (Which is how it all plays out.) The weak point of this plan is the deception. If she picks up on his real feelings and calls his bluff, then the plan would fail. I think that's why, before battle, he's trying to kill all his feelings and reduce everything to lust so he passes the check. Loved your reactions and discussions on this arc.
Palm
2025-10-07 23:51:55 +0000 UTCWhen Araragi says to Oshino that he does not feel sympathy towards Hanekawa, and he only feels turned on and lust towards her, he is definitely lying. Right now, I am unsure if he does or does not feel sympathy towards her, but I do believe he definitely felt like dying for her in that moment. But, he does not want to talk about that with Oshino. So, instead of opening up about how deeply he feels for Hanekawa and how he wants to give his life for her, he plays the role of the pervert that everyone always expects him to be. That is his mask, that is his defence. In addition to that, remember that he didn't tell his "ultimate trick" to Oshino when he left. And what was his ultimate trick, the trick that Oshino could not do? It was simply dying for Hanekawa.
magnificent_owl
2025-05-19 04:15:21 +0000 UTCIt's crazy how long I've watched this show and I still find new perspectives. I never did connect his speech towards hanekawa as a way of him to vent about himself.
Oisif
2025-05-19 03:08:46 +0000 UTCGreat discussion! I love the difference in opinions about Hanekawa's situation. It shows how thought-provoking the show is. Holy shit. I'm kicking myself for not giving this arc as many rewatches as the rest of the series. I didn't expect to tear up watching this. His speech to Black Hanekawa is 2 times more impactful when you realize how hard he's projecting. He even stops addressing her at one point and says "we'll have nightmares all our lives". He's using Hanekawa and the cat to vent about his feelings about himself and Shinobu. Remember the line from the previous episode? "Carrying out the moral directive like a machine". It seems like he feels that way about saving Shinobu in Kizu. "Don't use the cat as an excuse, don't use an aberration as a pretext. Don't use misfortune as a platform for growth". As I said in one of the comments before. Araragi really hates talking about himself, but you can learn bits and pieces about him through how he describes and talks to others. I'm happy that you find him interesting because many people (including me on my first watch) have on opposite impression because of how “bland” he seems compared to all the colorful characters he talks about in these stories.
Gromzi
2025-05-18 22:57:28 +0000 UTCthat ending monologue makes me tear up every time
sorbet
2025-05-18 18:40:00 +0000 UTCI’m ready for next arc, one of my favs and refreshing change in storytelling up till now 🙏
Lark
2025-05-18 17:57:44 +0000 UTCAs for Hanekawa's failures as well as her parents, there is no "right" person in that situation. Hanekawa's fault lies in the fact that, like Chillih mentioned similarities to Kanbaru, deep down she felt her life was unfair and wanted to take it out on people. Normally this is a sort of deeply buried "intrusive thought" for her that she represses by playing up the role of a perfect goody-two-shoes. Many of us have thoughts like this but know better than to act on them and have the self-awareness to recognize that they are wrong. Sometimes we hit rock bottom though, and we let all that bottled-up stress out at once, which is what Black Hanekawa represents. Her bottled up stress and feelings that she doesn't give any room are unleashed and she tries to shift the blame onto the "oddity" (alternate personality) when it's her fault that she is trying to pretend that she doesn't have these problems. Her fault that she pretends to be a paragon of a normal girl and downplay her issues. Hanekawa is such an excellently written character and I'm excited for you guys to follow the rest of her journey.
Jaron Clark
2025-05-18 17:24:50 +0000 UTCThis story likes to play with the many different meanings of the word love in my interpretation, especially in relation to Araragi. There are many different kinds of love/attraction that could be labeled as such, and this arc to me is Araragi learning the difference. In my opinion, Araragi loves her platonically, but not romantically. In the beginning of NekoKuro he tried to learn whether his feeling were romantic or not, which is what the conversation with Tsukihi was about. At this point in the story he's only seen the cheerful, perfect, righteous girl that she has shown him. He is attracted to the idealized version of her, like the kind of romantic attraction you feel to someone you barely know but they seem so perfect. I'm sure most of us have been there... and oftentimes, those sorts of people end up not being worth pursuing in my experience. By the time he had the showdown with Black Hanekawa (who IS Hanekawa) he is somewhat disillusioned by her hypocrisy and realizes her perfect student president persona is mostly a facade to hide her baggage. Plus, she puts him on too high of a pedestal which freaks him out because as we've seen Araragi DOES NOT think he deserves anything like that. This is also why Senjougahara fits him so well, she doesn't hold back in pointing out his flaws and putting him in his place. As for his sexual desire for Hanekawa... he definitely lusts after her of course, but that part of him harbors no actual romantic feelings imo (re:Tsukihi conversion of lust vs love.) The platonic part of him "loves" and cares for her as a friend who has been through a lot with him, but he can't bring himself to "love" her romantically. I think he uses his attraction for her as a veil at the end of this episode when talking to Oshino, to hide how much he cares for her and as a way to remind himself that reciprocating her feelings won't end up well for either of them. After all, there's no reason that platonic love can't be stronger than romantic love...
Jaron Clark
2025-05-18 17:13:00 +0000 UTCThis episode still perplexes me a bit, so I'm excited for whenever I finally get to read its corresponding novel. I think Oshino was, in a way, taunting Araragi into taking a strong stance about his feelings for Hanekawa. Though I think he truly considers himself neutral. About Araragi, I think this is probably the most obvious showing yet of how messed up he is mentally. I think a crucial aspect that a lot of people miss is that Araragi doesn't say "I would die for Hanekawa," he says "I WANT to die for Hanekawa." As he says in this episode: even if it was completely useless as a way to help her, he was happy in dying for her. I would call it a sort of selfish selflessness. A martyr complex, maybe. This is the most extreme example, but he has done this a lot through what you've seen of Monogatari. In Kizu, he gives himself to Kiss-shot and then wishes to commit suicide as atonement, in the Suruga Monkey arc he fights Kanbaru with the hidden intention to die by her hands to fix the situation, in Nadeko Snake he almost dies protecting some unknown boy before Kanbaru stops him. It's not until Tsubasa Cat that he finally decides not to die (after considering death once again) thanks to his love with Senjougahara, and the bonds he's made with others. That's why his monologue is so interesting this episode. It's Araragi at his lowest, it's one of the times where we can least trust him to teach us a proper lesson. He's irrational, seeking death and claiming that effort is worthless, that they'll always remember the bad, so the good is not worth it. And yet, some of the speech has some actual worthwhile meaning as well. He reads her situation perfectly. He completely understands what she is and why she chose to become it. He refuses to pity her, and instead views her as an active agent in her own life, someone who can and must save herself. He shows his inner strengths even in his weakest moment. Anyways, great ep and great video. Neko Kuro is quite a bit slower than the rest, and not quite as entertaining for me, but this episode more than makes up for it in my opinion.
ATableWithPants
2025-05-18 16:35:46 +0000 UTC
