Helayna Background Poll

Ah shucks... But yeah, I do see your point. Hopefully something like that is coming in the future?

Requiem

Rowan's not going to allow Helayna to go into battle; he's going to keep her at his side. And Helayna's going to be too conflicted over the death of Rosarians to do much besides cling to Rowan. Out of character for both.

Scott Carter

Since the storyline for Helayna seems to be getting a revamp regardless of the outcome of this vote, there is something I would love to see added to the storyline for her. Since Rowan can help train her again as a Knight if you choose that path, and that can occur before the Battle of Astarte, why not add her into that battle? Then she can use the aid that Jezera said she'd give her to help maintain her focus for a battle. But then maybe give it a twist and have the battle lust overcome her afterwards and have her get into a big celebration orgy with the orcs, which of course Rowan happens to see. Then he can have a choice to join in on the orgy (which may include him and other orcs all having her at the same time, #DP), thus gaining more corruption, or not and stay true to his pure nature. And this could happen before the scene with Andras.

Requiem

Bruh the teacher student line is objectively better. Like The others are neat if you love those cliches but like, as the poll states, they are nowhere near as interesting as teacher/ student and kinda make the story less interesting as well.

Barkups

If we're given adequate choices for how Rowan feels about Helayna, I don't see how "Old Friends" and "Teacher/Student" need to be distinct choices. Mechanically, it seems more feasible to set the back story to one thing, and then allow the player to decide how amicable that relationship was. An amicable, bordering on romantic teacher/student relationship can basically read as old friends, just as a by the books teacher/student thing can read as respected acquaintances. All this to say: I guess I don't really care what the back story is as long as I can make sure Rowan and Helayna had a positive relationship.

Nitu

At this point it's a compulsion. :)

Scott Carter

A long essay with detailed critical analysis of a point. You can tell you were once a teacher! :-)

Icarus Media

I suppose that, since the discussion is still going on, that it wouldn't hurt for me to express my opinion. I'm a firm supporter of the teacher/student relationship between Rowan and Helayna, for a number of reasons. To answer one objection, when I was in grad school I taught students who were no more than four years younger than myself. I (attempted) to learn fencing from an instructor who was only two years older than me, and had a Tae Kwon Do instructor who was several years younger. I'm really not sure why anyone thinks that there would need to be a big age difference between Rowan and Helayna for him to be her old instructor. As the narrative goes, I think Helayna is at the very least five years younger than Rowan. To answer another objection, I really don't see why Rowan had to have an especially close relationship to Helayna for Alexia to feel threatened by her. Whatever the relationship, Helayna has had an infatuation with Rowan for some time, and at least one of the options in the "Helayna has been claimed" event is for Rowan to have returned it on some level. Hell, I can see why Alexia would easily feel threatened just by the fact that Rowan is going to be fucking another, younger woman for an indeterminate length of time. On the "peasant teaching noble" front, that happened. Yeoman, who may have been either peasants or minor nobles, taught combat arts to nobles, and that's well recorded. In any case, Helayna had specifically requested that Rowan instruct her over the objections of her uncle. So those are the objections. My big reason for Rowan having been Helayna's teacher is the impact of that relationship. Rowan has known Helayna likely since she was in her early to mid-teens, and she's maintained that relationship over the years by repeatedly seeking his advice. He was responsible for her, and now he's responsible for the suffering she has to endure, being robbed of the person she was For instance, having her say "Hello, teacher" when she first walks in in "Dinner Is Served" is a kick in the gut. And what follows after that? Brutal. As for the alternative, having to fuck the woman who was the young girl Rowan once taught in order to protect her is a pretty horrible situation, intensified by the fact that he's partly aroused by it. After Rowan does confess to loving Helayna, well, retraining her as knight is at least close to their old relationship and, under the circumstances, maybe a little too close. Taking the other path, training this young woman he's known since she was a teenager as his bedslave is a mark that, whatever good intentions Rowan thinks he has, he's corrupting himself under Jezera's influence. And I think that, by that point, Jezera sees Rowan as something of a protégé. Incidentally, anyone who has the developer build knows that, behind the scenes, Rowan's protection of Helayna slowly but surely corrupts him. The path Rowan has to take to defend Helayna makes him almost as much a victim of the ring as she is. So that's my defense of my position on the poll; I hope everyone at least understands my reasoning and, even if you don't agree with it, at least feel that I'm arguing from what I feel is the better narrative.

Scott Carter

“I love democracy” - old space wizard

Just a Genius

I'm also much more of a fan of the Old Friends back story. I think it adds a ton to whichever path you take with her. If you're like me and play the "they loved each other but couldn't be together" card, it makes it a lot sweeter regardless of whether you take the knight or sub route, but if you don't typically claim her, it also makes that a lot more heart-wrenching. I just think over-all, it heightens the emotional value of her whole plot.

Nitu

For what it's worth, neither side has really been silent, and everyone's arguing their preferred version in good faith. Neither you nor I are wrong in our preference, and I respect your opinion, as I hope you respect mine. NTR isn't my thing, but I don't avoid it every single time I play through the game. My wife and I go through different narratives, depending on what either of us want to play at any particular time. I respect whatever decision the creators make, and I wouldn't want them to have to do extra unplanned work if major events are going to be dependent on a single direction. Who knows? Maybe this will work out in a way that satisfies us both.

Scott Carter

Yes, I really like that idea, Requiem!

Isefesira

Calm down, we'll take your feedback into consideration. The goal isn't to ruin the game for anyone.

Lord Arioch

i wish i could find the words to say to turn this around, or better yet, prevent this damn poll from ever happening in the first place. but i can't protect anything i care about, not even the little things.

Glad teacher is ahead, that seems to make the most sense.

Xsandman78

Actually combineing Old Friends with Teacher and Student would work best now that you mention it. IT would require less rework since players could still pick how Rowan "feels" his relationship with Helayna was. Also Alexia and Helayna being old friends would give her a possible history of already being suspicious of Rowan, or hesitantly bi-curious.

Nathan Phoenix

Teacher and Student. It adds to her "I want him but its not appropriate" vibe

Nathan Phoenix

Teacher and student make the most sense to me, I don't think people of such different classes could get away with meeting frequently for personal reasons, it seems more reasonable that they got to know each other while Rowan was performing some sort of service for them, in this case teaching.

Sand3132

shit. i was just in a situation where the silent majority voted for something that craps all over a story i was invested in. now i get to relive that nightmare all over again.

So what if the two that everyone is arguing for are combined? Think about it, Alexia stayed home and Helayna was too young to be in the war. Somehow they could have been friends, since peasants are employed in noble homes. Then, when Rowan gets back from the wars, he meets Helayna through Alexia because they are friends. Having heard of him and exploits through Alexia, of course Helayna would want to be taught by Rowan. And this would also result in Alexia, Rowan, and Helayna all knowing each other and having a friendship beyond just the teacher/student relationship. That would also make the emotions Alexia feels toward Helayna over her sleeping with Rowan far stronger. Nothing worse than your BFF sleeping with your hubby. Unless, of course, you are into that... 😉

Requiem

I loved the Student Teacher interaction. It felt real.

Scythe Massakur

Can only tell my own Opinion on that but I always liked the Teacher & Student variant more, I think logically speaking Old Friends would be the most reasonable, however thats not really my taste. Teacher & Student > Bed Whore has always been my choice... ^^'

Aezyn

Well, peasants absolutely did teach nobles in combat as yeomen. And as someone who, in college and grad school, both taught and was taught by people who were close to my age, that doesn't ring false either. I know that I'd be really creeped out by the idea of training a former student as my sub. That, if you follow that path, Jezera has convinced Rowan that it's a *good* idea to do so, marks just how much influence she's having over him. In context, it works really well.

Scott Carter

Keep in mind that Helayna specifically asked for Rowan to teach her, and Duke Doran wasn't at all pleased about it.

Scott Carter

Old friends feels like the most natural option IMHO. Respected acquaintances is also a reasonable option. Teacher and student seems the least likely... I mean do you wanna Dirt General teaching your daughter?

TheJackinati

Yes, there's definitely precedent for peasants teaching nobles the arts of combat. And teacher and student fits in so many ways: Helayna idolizes Rowan as much as she's infatuated with him; the story repeatedly mentions that Helayna is younger than Alexia; and the bedslave and knight (when it's added) training paths gain a lot of weight by making Rowan her old teacher.

Scott Carter

Old friends feels much more natural than teacher and student given how events can play out in the game. Feels like that option has much more to work with and give than teacher and student.

Dracker Drap

I never really noticed what choice i made because it felt like it only ever changed a line or two. I could be completely wrong of course since there's so many lines of dialog in the game. But reading the comments made me vote for Old Friends. Esp Shadow5's reason for their choice. Having them be old friends does bring a more compelling reason for Alexia to feel threatened by Helayna.

Yshomatsu

I didn't expect teacher and student to do so well. I am pleased. I know a few people are against it, but saying they wouldn't allow a peasant to teach is just factually wrong, Hawkers, Archers, and soldiers would all teach nobles. Being as Rowan was a general somehow, he would have been chosen to educate his noble patrons and as she was close to his village, Her family would be quick to take advantage.

Soulandshadow

Old friends all the way!

Benjamin K

Crossing my fingers for old friends option to pull ahead. Teacher and student just doesn't feel right or fit in my opinion.

Come on Old Friends!!! Old Friends for the win! Please don't make me be her Senpai. I don't want to be a Senpai!

SoloStudios

I’m hoping Old Friends pulls out ahead somehow. Being friends, especially with the class difference, is especially powerful and makes the choice to enslave her far more difficult, since she’d have been the only voice of concern towards him among the nobles who didn’t give a shit. Teacher/Student feels like a typical trope and I hope it isn’t what actually wins. Edit: Also, being old friends is a far more compelling narrative to Alexia, since that level of connection (old friends) could be more dangerous to their marriage than a student and teacher. Alexia would feel more threatened by Helayna in that case, and while she may forgive Rowan more because of that strong bond between him and Helayna (understanding why he did it), she'd be more watchful of Helayna's actions for the same reason with Helayna.

Shadow5

Not a fan of teacher and student. They're too close in age and as mentioned above I don't think a peasant would be allowed to teach a noble. Old friends makes more sense because it makes the betrayal all that much worse.

able_to_think

aw crap, teacher and student is winning, probably because its the one most people chose and didn't even bother to check out the others, because old friends is much more compelling.

I feel like it's out of place with the rest of the storyline for him to be a teacher to her since she's a noble and he's a peasant. This kingdom seems pretty rigid with its class structure. The age gap also doesn't seem significant enough for Teacher-Srudent

Titan15205