Tools, Glorious Tools! #6 - Which Lathe Should I Buy?

Just an FYI when we try to watch this video on YouTube it shows commercials.

David Wheelen

Sorry for the late reply Mark, your message slipped by me and I only just noticed it - I live in a metric part of the world, so its not something I notice or even think about. I use Imperial units for certain things, mostly for legacy reasons, but I don't think I've ever had cause to cut an Imperial thread so I can't offer much advice in that regard (others here will be able to advise I expect). On the odd occasion I find myself using a machine with imperial dials I do find myself working a little harder, but that's mainly because I have grown up thinking in metric. Cheers :)

Clickspring

Its a little bit annoying to have to fuss wth it, but I rarely use the gearbox so its not a big deal - Cheers :)

Clickspring

G'day Chris. I am considering the red Sieg lathe myself and curious of your opinion of not having a quik change gear box on it.

Dan Sanford

Any thoughts on a metric based lathe (metric pitch lead screws; metric dials) versus imperial? Even though I live in United States, I prefer to use SI units. In US, the importers [e.g. Grizzly, Jet, Precision Matthews] bring in imperial based machines exclusively even though the manufacturers in China and Taiwan are producing metric based machines for their global markets. I asked one importer about getting the metric version. He said, "Yes. I can special order that one if you are sure that's what you want?" I felt like there was an implied, "but you will probably regret it" in his answer. The lathes I have used at community college and at maker spaces were imports [Jet] with imperial pitch lead screws. The dials were dual reading imperial-centric [.05 inch per turn, 1.27mm per turn]. I’ve heard that cutting metric threads on an imperial machine is a little easier than cutting imperial threads on a metric machine.

Mark McClure

Hello mate - the thing that led me to pull the trigger was the need for redundancy. My production would grind to a halt if I lose the red lathe, as it takes several months to get this sort of machine shipped to my part of the world. Having said that, its very convenient to be able to chuck up some stock on a second lathe to avoid breaking down a setup on the other lathe, so 2 lathes in the shop is a massive plus. The blue lathe also is better suited to the larger jobs - It can take 1" stock down the spindle for example, which is something I am making good use of today. Re Metex, I am not familiar with the name, but a quick look at some images on google suggests to me that they are a Weiss re-brand. It is common for both Sieg and Weiss to appear re-branded with slightly different specs/paint job/name plates etc to distinguish them in a given importers market - Cheers :)

Clickspring

Hi Chris. I've watched this video a few times and was wondering why you purchased the "blue" lathe. Was there something the "red" one wasn't doing for you? As part of my research, I have come across the Metex brand of lathes and mills. These are a bit beefier than the SIEG and Weiss and I was wondering if you have heard anything of them.

Benny

Hi Chris. I know your time is at a premium at the moment, but could you put a "Which mill should I buy" video on your to do list please?

Benny

Hello mate - the main issue as the stock gets larger is holding it to make the cuts. The chuck jaws are relatively shallow and of course the bore is narrow too. So while its still a capable little machine, everything gets a little more awkward as you approach the upper limits - Cheers :)

Clickspring

G'day Chris. I'm really keen on getting a lathe for my garage, I don't have much space to play with and, as the parts I make will generally be small, I'm really looking closely at the Sherline. I can see it's obviously fantastic for small parts, but in your experience how is it at the upper end of it's capacity, say 2.5" - 3.5"?

Spadge Fox

Gday Chris, spose I should have said the apron had a sight glass Doh… But in my defence Gov there is a grease gun icon on the left hand side of said apron, hence the do I or don't I. It looks like they have drilled in situ and all the swarf was left in the sump :( Thanks for the reply Best Regards G :) … Have asked for an update on the manual as the exploded diagrams are nothing like the lathe !!!???

Graeme Brumfitt

Hello mate, not filled but oil is apparently present via the little sight glass on the right hand side. I haven't dug into the manual on this yet either, let me know what you learn - Cheers :)

Clickspring

Gday Chris, Question if I may? Is the apron assembly on your lathe filled with oil or are the gears greased, mine has neither although the sump is wet, my manual doesn't say either way! The gearbox assembly does have oil in and is topped up to mark. Cheers for any help. Best Regards G :)

Graeme Brumfitt

Not sure Peter, I'd need to understand the design better before commenting - if you're following plans tho, I'd suggest that its a problem that's already been solved by whoever came up with the design - Cheers :)

Clickspring

Great video, wish I had watched it sooner. Rather than buy a lathe (Canadian Pesos aren't worth that much right now so the cheaper "so-so" lathes aren't so cheap here), I'm headed down the route of the Concrete Lathe and I'm building my own. Just with hardened rails instead of pipe and a removable headstock like the Sherline. Anyway, since I'm building it are there any methods for confirming alignments that you would recommend? Like, once I have the bed flat, rails put in and made parallel, and the headstock installed, how best would I align the headstock to the rails?

Peter R

I can only speak of the 2 import machines I have purchased, and each required about the same amount of work - The Sherline is a sweet little lathe, no experience with their mill - Cheers :)

Clickspring

Is there one import brand that stands out as higher quality requiring less time/effort and expertise to tune/optimize? Also, what do you think about Sherline lathes and mills? Thanks

Brendan Murphy

Cheers Chris JOBBER IT IS THEN

Graeme Brumfitt

Ha ha! Cheap and cheerful is the go, until it isn't - then shell out the bigger ££'s - Cheers mate :)

Clickspring

Gday Chris, question if I may? have been making some T nuts for the mill WPS No35 "should have used the mill to drill all the holes instead of the drill press" Grrr anyway the Q is I need a 8.7mm drill for finish to tap, jobbers for £1.85 or Solid Carbide Stub Drill "looks the BD, Bogs Dollocks" for 17£? or cheap drill and reamer? Oh You sly young dog making me work to find things out lol anyway it worked I found out that the swivel for the vice was not torqued down hence vibration. Best Regards G

Graeme Brumfitt

Great to hear mate - lotsa fun when it turns up :) Re the finish, it will depend on a lot of factors - RPM, DOC, feed rate, workholding rigidity etc - the detective work is half the fun :)

Clickspring

Gday Chris, lathe in stock so now ordered gone for the Warco WM250V can't wait for that toy to arrive once again budget blown :0 The mill is now on a home made bench and today I actually made something for it, it was just a stop for cutting slots or limiting travel (don't know why it isn't included as there are tapped holes for said item) but I made it and it does its job:) not quite an AM lol. Question if I may, I used a four flute to cut said work when held vertically and bottom of the cutter was used the finish was good but when used horizontally and the side was used the finish wasn't so good cutter speed was about 700 cutter size was 11mm, feed rate? Any ideas please Chris? Best Regards G

Graeme Brumfitt

I made some marking blue using shellac flakes dissolved in meths and added gentian violet (2:1 meth:violet) and it works better than the original! Kinda hard to get the original liquid marking blue in South Africa...

franco pucci

Hey Ross, yes you are correct that wheel did not fit on the SC4, so I turned it (and cut the teeth) on the green lathe (9x20) - I think its got to be close to the upper limit for general clock work, I've yet to find one larger outside of tower clock work, although some dials do get quite large too - Cheers :)

Clickspring

Hi Chris - thinking back to the Skeleton clock project, the great wheel was probably the largest diameter piece that you had to turn or fabricate. Did this fit on the SIEG, or was it one for the green/blue lathe? In general, is that about the upper limit in diameter for clock making work? I'm fortunate enough to live in an industrial / manufacturing city in the UK - we're awash with machines, unlike my budget!

Ross Goodley

Yes, a video on leveling would be GREAT i just got a new lathe and this would be very helpful.

Hershal Wiggins

Hi Ian, terrific to have you on board mate. Do you mean a video on leveling? If so, very happy to do one :)

Clickspring

Sounds interesting Ross, send me thru the link and I'll check it out :)

Clickspring

Hi Chris, maybe unrelated to your TGT threads but I stumbled across this page (and some of the post either side) which cover ancient lathes and some measuring / machining processes - maybe a compliment to the Antikythera tool playlist?

Ross Goodley

I understand Pat, thanks for sharing and please feel free to ask as many Q's as required to clear up any points :)

Clickspring

Sorry, but this episode has the "background" music a little too much in the foreground, seems everyone is doing it lately. As we get older some of us need to concentrate on the lesson & whats being taught, for me thats "no music" wherever possible, boring i know but i am in a classroom enviroment during each episode...

Pat Dunne

Ha ha! Cheers mate :)

Clickspring

I was thinking that I don't have the money or the space for a lathe but then a solution occurred to me. Sell the kids to the circus, I'll get a few quid and I can convert their bedrooms into more workshop space. Now, how do I tell the wife....? Joking aside, many thanks Chris for another thought provoking video. Cheers, Gary

Gary Knight

Awesome mate, the course is a great idea :)

Clickspring

Awesome as usual Chris. Weird thing is I've been looking at both of the lathes you have but only after hunting for projects and stuff I wish to build. I've already got a small steam engine kit I'm looking at, knowing the dimensions of that I know I can make that plus slightly bigger ones with possibly just the Sherline though I'd probably get the same model with the longer bed. Heh, already have a long list of stuff mostly in order of purchase and timescale. Already drawn up a basic plans for a lathe plinth/cabinet to contain the chips etc. I'm still researching books, materials suppliers, projects etc, along with endless video's and forum guides just so I have a whole lot of stuff to do/learn without getting bored, one of my big problems is not finishing what I start but hobby machining isn't cheap........ so I have to make sure it's something I want to do hence why I've been looking at short courses on manual machining, just to try it out before I go buying a very expensive paperweight, hee.

Matthew Sykes

What would you recommend in a smaller lathe (say 10-12 inches) that does not require much in the way of tweaking/optimization? My hobby spare time is pretty limited so I'd like to avoid too much down time and frustration. Thanks again!

Brendan Murphy

I'd love to see the Clickspring route to a correctly levelled mini lathe (quick, precise, beautifully filmed, edited and narrated)

Matt Waite

Awesome John, it looks like a very capable machine :)

Clickspring

Chris, since I last talked to you, I finally got a lathe, a Precision Matthews 1236T So far, I love it!!! I had the little Grizzly I bought used for about a week, and it was a mistake, it was way to small, so it's going back up for sale. The new one has .0001 tir on the chuck and without much work is about .001 in 18" taper, I haven't got into tuning that yet, still thinking about moving it around in the shop.

Maybe :)

Clickspring

Hey Brendan - my personal preference is to have separate machines - Cheers :)

Clickspring

No problem: <a href="https://www.patreon.com/file?h=19145928&amp;i=2252145">https://www.patreon.com/file?h=19145928&amp;i=2252145</a> - Cheers :)

Clickspring

What is your view of combination machines (lathe/mill) ? I think Grizzly makes one. Thanks!

Brendan Murphy

The second you brought up leveling a lathe I KNEW you were going to mention Tony. How could you not... Him and keith do an awesome job of spelling it all out Are you guys going to do more with origins? That is still one of my favorite youtube crossover vids "How do you reckon they are going to do that pointy bit??" :D

Clifton Ballad

Great videos as always. How about a post script at the end summarising the points in text?

Andrew Smith

:)

Clickspring

Hey Andrew, yes a slight mod required for the SC4: make a new post that threads directly into the topslide, and then mill out each of the tool holders to bring the cutter down. Will be doing a vid on the WM250 topslide, but that is a different mod - Cheers :)

Clickspring

Chris, I just bought my first lathe (Sieg SC4 Hi torque) plus a Quick Change Tool Post and ran into exactly the problem you described...I thought "what an idiot, I've bought the wrong tool post!" when I couldn't see how to mount it. Now I'm eagerly awaiting your vid on how to solve that :)

I think telling us how this happened would help out in us setting up a proper shop: <a href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ycoCwoplU6Y" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ycoCwoplU6Y</a> This way we could go back and correct our mistakes. Unless it involves pie.

Kevin Reardon

Trying? coined and minted :)

Clickspring

Stop trying to make streets ahead a thing Pierce.

Hey John, yes its outside my wheelhouse, but plenty of folks here that will be able to answer I am sure - Cheers :)

Clickspring

Being Australian I'd guess this is outside your area of expertise, but would you have an opinion on what would be best for a home gunsmithing lathe?

John P

Cheers mate!

Clickspring

Another great video, thanks Chris. My first lathe was a very small 7x12 Sieg lathe and although I had a lot of fun making tools to overcome it's deficiencies, I never really solved the weedy little tailstock so it's great that you're warning others to avoid that pitfall. I'm not convinced by the T-Slotted cross-slide argument: I can see it's convenience, but both the non-slotted machines I have used have had other bolt holes that can be used for mounting accessories (albeit less flexibly) and it's a lot easier to put a hex head screw in a bolt hole to keep the swarf out than it is to cover a T-slot. One other thing I consider essential is a reversible chuck mount. I've "graduated" from the flange mount Sieg to a D1-3 on my "new" (30 year old) replacement, but a lot of the machines I looked at when upgrading had screw-mounted chucks, which prevent you from taking cuts when running backwards: I would find that a massive pain for several different situations that come up often in my workshop. Thanks again and as always I'm looking forward to the next TGT and the next build video!

Alan Budden

Thank you mate, I certainly will :) Re the shop setup, you may have already seen this, but if not I have some info on the initial shop setup here: <a href="https://youtu.be/rOV5mBIiJZs" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">https://youtu.be/rOV5mBIiJZs</a> - Cheers :)

Clickspring

Both good points Bruce, thanks for sharing :)

Clickspring

Yes I was thinking something along the same lines - its a tight fit that's for sure :)

Clickspring

Yes it would be a challenge to turn pivots on a 16 Inch lathe! Cheers mate :)

Clickspring

A great video, Chris and I hope you do many more. While I love these videos I was wondering if you have any advice or, would make a video, for those who are just starting out. It would be great to hear some recommendations for those things a startup machinist should have to venture into this great hobby.

Scott Clausen

Hmm, Enter does not function as I expected. No matter. First point is about branding, my Jutco appears to be an off brand and spare parts are not to be found, certainly with a little help from my friends, repairs are possible, but, is the lathe you are considering, commonly available in your part of the world. Second point is English practice of quoting height above centre versus US swing in lathe spec rather confused my early reading.

Bruce Weller

Maybe there is space to convert your lathe spindle to something like DIN55027. That has pegs with threaded studs and nuts of the same diameter as the studs. You slot the studs and nuts through the spindle hole and also through a knurled ring with a matching set of keyhole-shaped slots. Then rotate the ring and tighten the nuts. Or maybe a better plan is to make a D1-3 nose and bolt that permanently in place.

Andy Pugh

Great video Chris and always nice to note that at least a couple of my purchases were validated. Two points if I may:

Bruce Weller

One aspect of lathe selection you didn't mention is spindle speed range. You get the best results at specific surface speeds, and a larger lathe might not go fast enough to get the right speed on smaller work. At the extreme end some of the old HSS-Era 16-inch lathes top out at under 500 rpm. That's no good for clock parts. This isn't really related to what to buy, and you specifically exclude old iron from this video (which makes sense) but your mention of tailstocks reminded me of this photo I took, of the tailstock from my Chinese 9x20 lathe placed on the bed of my English 10x20 lathe. <a href="https://photos.app.goo.gl/uhV7gEl3VAedeFw93" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">https://photos.app.goo.gl/uhV7gEl3VAedeFw93</a> Well "On" isn't quite the word, it would drop down the middle.

Andy Pugh

Cheers Jorg :)

Clickspring

Thank you Paul :)

Clickspring

Thank you Scott :) Yes the back end run-out thing is a shocker isn't it. Its so rough inside each bore too, I would love to know what they are using as a roughing tool to open up the spindles!

Clickspring

Thanks for the tips Chris, the Monarch sounds like a beast :)

Clickspring

Hey Colin, I have an A2Z QCTP, but I think they may no longer exist? let me know if there is a gap in the market here and I'd be happy to do one as a Patron project in the future - Cheers :)

Clickspring

Its definitely an adventure buying a big chunk of cast iron - Cheers :)

Clickspring

Morning mate - I have the same issue here in Cairns, and after trying just about every idea I had heard of I have solved it by coating everything with a light film of oil. I use a light compressor oil, and wipe everything at the end of the day, or after handling if its going back in the drawer. For example files are stored in shallow trays with oil, machine surfaces, working tables etc are paint brushed with a film of oil, hand tools like countersinks etc are wiped with an oily rag. It solved the issue overnight. It requires a lot of discipline to stay on top of it - if I forget to wipe a tool, the next morning there will be flash rust to greet me - but such is the annoyance when this happens, I learned pretty quick!

Clickspring

Thanks Paul - Yes exactly, its amazing how the learning curve takes off, simply by making that start - Cheers :)

Clickspring

Cheers Giovanni!

Clickspring

I completely agree Lucus. Fixing this issue is probably the most challenging part of sorting out a new lathe. On the plus side, it makes sure you really get to know the machine - Cheers :)

Clickspring

Not in my experience Maarten - Hopefully you'll never inadvertently drop something on the bed with kinetic energy approaching an Alec Steele hammer hit!

Clickspring

Its a tight squeeze!

Clickspring

Ha ha! Very pleased its of help mate - Cheers :)

Clickspring

I'll keep an eye on it Kev, thanks for the tip :)

Clickspring

Thank you, that was a great video.

Jorg Jorgensen

Excellent video full of great ideas! Thanks for sharing Chris, and keep up the great work! Cheers. Paul

Paul Francis Madden

So many great tips, Chris! The one about tool to part scale is interesting and spot on. Back in the 90's I was working in a commercial millwork shop that had some of the largest, most desired tools that you've ever seen, and yet time and again I found myself near my bench working on my Shopsmith that I brought from my home shop. Partially because I was comfortable with it, but mostly because I found that it better matched the scale of the fine, detailed projects I was building. Also, that beck-end runout bit me once too. After discovering the issue I just couldn't believe that the manufacturer would have let that slide. Great video, Chris.

My Growth Rings

I would suggest a dedicated bolt on collet chuck over the morse taper style. The morse taper chucks need a drawbar that prevents the stock from going through the head. I also find that the bigger hand wheels on big machines make precision much easier. The only downside I find with small work on big machines is the limited RPM. My big monarch lathe tops out at 700RPM.

Chris McDonald

Absolutely hang on to it. I made the mistake of selling my smaller lathe when I upgraded and regret it to this day.

Ken Condal

Hey Chris. Which QCTP holder do you have for your Sherline? I would like a set for mine but having a hard time justify the cost of the factory Sherline setup.

Colin Dick

Yeah, I spent quite a bit of time researching on the topic, but ended up pulling the trigger on a TU-2506V (plus the BF-20AV milling head) because Machinery House Melbourne was having a moving sale so I got a pretty decent deal on it and a bunch of tooling. Pity about the part where their freight company sent a truck with a broken lift gate though. The lathe survived basically getting dropped off the side of the truck remarkably well.

Jrandom Bob

Good morning Chris. One of the issues I have in SouthEast Texas is humidity. It's a constant battle keeping my equipment and tools rust free. This is probably the biggest reason I have not gotten a lathe or mill yet. But alas, another great video to go with my first cup of coffee of the day :-)

Chris Muncy

Great video as always Chris! Taking into account what you said about lathe sizes, I have a very small mini lathe that I used to get started and i believe i'm ready to step up the size - should i hold onto the little one for small parts and buy a larger lathe aswell or sell it off when i just get a larger one? A hard question i know so feel free not to answer it - just a fraction lost... Cheers!

Matthew Thomas

Another great video Chris. I am in the process of clearing down my unfinished woodturning project so i can get started learning to machine metal. As you said in this video I just need to get started. Make a mess work out what tooling is missing / needed and buy as you go.

Paul Busby

Thanks for this video! I have been wanting to buy a lathe for a while for smaller aluminum part manufacturering. Finally a great guide I can use from someone I trust!

Giovanni Viscardi

The problem with import tail stocks are no joke! It took me about a week to get my tailstock running true and it was one of the hardest parts of tuning my machine. But once I got it the quality of work it could produce went up drastically.

Lucus Landers

You mentioned the lathe bed (or track) being hardened and that this helps when you inevitably drop something, but doesn't the hardening increase the odds of chips breaking of the bed/track and being shot out at bullet speed? It's apparently the main reason why striking anvils used by blacksmiths are made of mild steel. (At least according to youtube blacksmith Alec Steele.)

Maarten Daalder

Hey Chris, I recall the video you did some time ago about the tiny tour of your home shop.... 😁 Where did you find space for a 3rd lathe? 🤔

Adam Ackels

My wife just asked me if I had written to you asking you to make the video! I have been talking about buying a new lathe so it is good to have your experience distilled down to help the decision.

James Cuddihy

At my university they have three import lathes with the same type of cover over the leadscrew as your blue lathe, and they fail to collapse right so it limits how close the carriage can get to the headstock. I can't say the design have impressed me, but of course the problem might be caused by the students using the lathes and not the design. Hopefully you have better luck with yours Chris.

Thank you mate :)

Clickspring

Once again showing all of your hallmarks Chris... Clear, concise, hugely informative, and beautifully produced. Thanks once again for another great video. I wonder how many people might avoid the problem of being unable to actually use/clean/maintain their lathe once installed, thanks to this vid. I would probably be one of them, if I actually had space to house a lathe. :)

Chris Talbot

So true Tom - Cheers :)

Clickspring

Good advice! I would add ease of changing gears to the list. Quick change gear box being a very handy feature! But I've had 2 lathes, one was ok, but the current one is a real pain to change and keep gears meshed (very frustrating to have them unmesh during the final spring cut of a thread!!)

Tom Wazny

Thank you mate :)

Clickspring

Great video yet again Chris :)

Aidan Jeffes

Wow Rob, 30 foot is a handful!

Clickspring

Certainly mate, no problem at all :)

Clickspring

Hey Chris! I loved this video--immediately watched when I got the notification. I do have a question though. I work with a lot of high school robotics teams and classes, and one of the common questions I get is how to select the proper machines to purchase with limited funds. Do you mind if I direct them to this video when I get these kinds of questions? Thanks a lot! Keep up the inspiring work.

Cothron Theiss