They Called Her Rebel: Speculative Fiction, Revolutionary Art, and the Politics of Imagination
Added 2025-11-20 11:20:31 +0000 UTCIn this episode, Breht speaks with Jacob Dallas-Main, co-host of Workers' Lit and author of They Called Her Rebel; a dazzling fusion of fantasy, class struggle, and storytelling set in a world of debtors’ camps, collapsing empires, and revolutionary possibility.
The two discuss how speculative fiction can illuminate political struggle, not merely as metaphor but as a call to break the boundary between audience and participant. They explore what makes a work of art revolutionary rather than consumable, the dangers of reactionary storytelling in popular culture, declining literacy in the U.S., the threats posed by AI, the need for socialist transformation, and why imagination is a vital force in times of despair.
From Le Guin to Kim Stanley Robinson to Lee Mandelo, they trace a lineage of speculative art that refuses cynicism and insists on transformation -- both political and personal.
Check out our episode with Kim Stanely Robinson on his book "Ministry for the Future" HERE
Subscribe to Workers Lit podcast on youtube HERE
Comments
Breht, I really enjoyed this discussion as someone who has loved speculative fiction their whole life and has thought about the connection between it and left radical politics! The modern western sci-fi and fantasy (SFF) world have historically been very eurocentric and chauvinist unfortunately which still lingers in aspects of many recent works (a bit more on this below). I was not aware of the Worker’s Lit podcast and have been searching for more leftist criticism of speculative fiction for a while (https://ancillaryreviewofbooks.org/ while great is a bit politically incoherent). I will have to check out They Called Her Rebel Though the conversation touched on her briefly, Ursula K Le Guin is one of my favorite writers and relevant to many of the topics brought up so I wanted to share some thoughts. Not sure how much you have delved into her or her work, but I think there were multiple aspects that may be of interest. The academic daughter of 2 academics, Le Guin’s parents are worth mentioning for their influential role in anthropology and passive influence on her work. Her father Alfred Kroeber (in collaboration with his wife Theodora) was a prominent anthropologist who spent the majority of his time documenting the culture of western Native American peoples. Notably a man named Ishi, long thought to be the last surviving member of the Yahi people (the whole story is both fascinating and problematic). In addition, he had a strong interest in eastern religion (specifically Daoism) and psychology. Le Guin herself was working towards a PhD in French when she rapidly met and then became married to her husband and quit her PhD. Upon the birth of her children in the following years, her primary role became a homemaker although she continued to carve out time to write daily; many of her seminal works were written during this period. Her work features evidence of an anthropologic, ecologic, and Dao and Buddhist worldview (she has a good translation of the Dao de jing) featuring (in an understated but persistent manner) non-white and eventually non-male characters and worlds with narratives that eschew traditional conflict and violence-based structures. Le Guin was equally influential in her non-fiction writing. She wrote incisively and passionately about the role of science fiction, fantasy, the imagination (and the unconscious), and the possibilities of art in achieving transformative political change within an individual and in society. She held all work in the field to a high standard, and tried to promote the breakdown of a shallow isolationist worldview (what she termed the SF ghetto) held among many SF writers and readers to argue for a more expansive and serious understanding of the role of SFF as equally valid in comparison to “realist” literature. It is important to remember the time in which much of this work happened (the late 1950s and onward) and the demographics of her fellow writers and readers. She was an ardent anti-capitalist with a primarily anarchist worldview (she once called herself a “petty-bourgeois anarchist”) for which there is much to critique. She admits to reading Engels and Marx although it is unclear what exactly this entails. In spite of this, she is commendable for her rigorous self-critique of her own work (writing essays evaluating and at times repudiating her prior thoughts and actions) and there is much to take away from her work in general. Interestingly, despite her status in the field I am unaware of a significant Marxist evaluation of her extensive body of work. I will briefly list and comment on some notable works below: - “The Ones Who Walk Away From Omelas”. Short story. Often discussed in high school or college ethics courses, Breht I wonder if you have been exposed! Has generated multiple short story responses - “The Carrier Bag Theory of Fiction”. One of her most influential non-fiction essays on story, centering anti-conflict and non-male/hero centered narratives. A brief read, highly highly recommended and in conjunction with some other essays could be good for a Red Menace style analysis - “The Dispossessed”. This one is personal and struck me like a thunderbolt when I first read it. I would like to highlight this quote near the end that to me emphasizes the subjective transformation required for sustained revolutionary praxis (abbreviated for space and to avoid spoilers but easily findable “We have nothing but our freedom … It is in your spirit, or it is nowhere”) - “The Language of the Night”. A collection of essays on the role of SFF. Worthwhile for anyone with even a passing interest in the genre to prompt reflection and analysis of even more modern SFF media. Featuring classics such as “Why are Americans Afraid of Dragons?”, “American SF and the Other”, “From Elfland to Poughkeepsie”. Special shoutout to “Stalin in the Soul” which features both a blistering indictment of the commodification of art and artist self-censorship while simultaneously incorporating anticommunist/anti-Soviet talking points and glorifying Solzhenitsyn - “Always Coming Home”. Describing a far future post-apocalyptic ecological civilization from the standpoint of an pseudo-anthropologic record, featuring plays, songs (some recorded), short stories, biographies. Challenging and comforting. Quoted in Max Ajl’s “A People’s Green New Deal” - The Earthsea Novels. Influential fantasy novels appropriate for middle grade children and up featuring many of the themes (Daoism, conflict, Jungian archetypes) already discussed. Years ago like your son I imbibed Calvin and Hobbes and Earthsea around the same time. If he has not been exposed, it may be something he would enjoy. The 4th novel in the series is a masterpiece, but also darker and more mature than the first 3. - Speech at the 2014 national book awards for lifetime achievement (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Et9Nf-rsALk). A brief 5 minute watch which in an of itself is incredible in championing SFF, art, and anti-commodification, but elevates in the context of being delivered to a room full of publishing company execs with specific critique of Amazon’s ebook practices. “We live in capitalism. Its power seems inescapable. So did the divine right of kings. Any human power can be resisted and changed by human beings. Resistance and change often begin in art, and very often in our art, the art of words.” - If any of this is interesting, I recommend checking out this series within the Between the Covers podcast (https://tinhouse.com/th_podcast_cat/crafting-with-ursula/) which spent 1 episode/month in 2022 featuring in depth discussions on Le Guin’s work. One episode in the series features Kim Stanley Robinson who was mentored early on by Le Guin. The host David Naimon is very meticulous in his preparation and personally knew Le Guin and interviewed her multiple times near the end of her life. A conversation between you and David on Le Guin would be interesting! I am also compelled to mention briefly another favorite Octavia Butler (writing as a working class black woman in the mid-late 20th century white-male dominated SFF field) whose book Parable of the Sower was brought up in this episode and whose overall body of work has always dealt with the dialectic between individual and group and a criticism of hierarchical thinking (https://sdonline.org/issue/42/octavia-butler-and-base-american-socialism). If any of this is interesting and in the spirit of expanding boundaries, I would like to recommend the two books (both multi-award winning in the past 2 years) of Vajra Chandrasekara: 1. The Saint of Bright Doors 2. Rakesfall Both are told from an unapologetic Sri Lankan point of view which incorporates South Asian mythology (The Saint of Bright Doors heavily features Buddhist concepts and history which flew over a lot of western reader’s heads). Rakesfall – while a more challenging read - is my personal favorite, and coming full circle, recently won the Ursula K Le Guin Prize for Fiction (see his brief but powerful anti-imperialist acceptance speech halfway through this video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y5h5ZDjWPTc). This prize was recently established but aims to recognize experimental speculative fiction writers, especially those who may have been marginalized in the production process (https://www.ursulakleguin.com/prize-overview). If anyone already has or ever ends up reading these books, I would love to hear your thoughts! Breht - and anyone else that made it this far - I know you are busy, so there is no expectation to fully engage with anything/everything I have written. Le Guin’s nonfiction is salient to this discussion given her place in and critique of speculative fiction. At a minimum I think the youtube links I have posted are brief and easily digested, and the Le Guin one reveals much of her overall values. Somes of the essays I highlighted above are quite short and easily found online. At the time of my writing this, there hasn’t been as much discussion as other episodes, but this is an important topic regarding the subjective forces of revolution and political change so I decided to write this up
surkesh
2025-11-21 17:29:53 +0000 UTCThis was a great conversation! I really liked the analysis of media, it brought up some points that I have never thought of myself.
Choncie
2025-11-21 16:45:01 +0000 UTC
