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Q&A for the 26th!

One question per patron and get your question in by Friday 4/22!

All right folks, it's been a little over a year and we're working on a couple special projects.  A perfect time for another marathon C&Rsenal Q&A episode!

Questions, of course, are from YOU.  Our patrons!

We'll do our best to answer them all.  There are, of course, some limits to what we can cover without doing a whole week's worth of research!

Q&A for the 26th!

Comments

At what point is re bluing a classic firearm ok?

Matthew lloyd

Shit just seen this! 😭

Matthew lloyd

Mae Responding: All right, all questions are in, we'll gather them up and get our Q&A recording going here soon!

C&Rsenal

Update on the black powder series. More black powder please.

Chris Marchi

Have you and or Jonathan Ferguson had any luck with recovery efforts of the UPS/British customs lost WWI Galilean Sights?

Mustafa's Fleas

Was the concept of a device that could be inserted into a bolt action rifle that turned it into a pistol-caliber self-loader inherently flawed from the start, or would it be conceivably workable with the right engineering, but the Pedersen Device was just a poor implementation?

Daniel Funderburg

What is it that drives you to strive for the best presentation and information for these firearm documentaries? Could you muster the same energy and passion for a different topic, or are firearms inherently different?

PizzaPony

Hi Gang! My question is on if you will be doing an episode on the Martini Henry specifically the 577/450 version? Best single shot in my opinion 🙃. The work you two do is truly amazing. Thank you.

Kieran

If you were going to do a Project Litening-esque series om weapons from another conflict, what conflict would you choose and what guns would you want to include?

Jaswimmly

Hello crew, I'd been asking myself, if you were to have unlimited acces to any museum and to any local food you want where would you travel? ( All expenses paid) much love from Argentina, keep up your great work (◍•ᴗ•◍)❤

Shishi Soulez

What set of revolver features from all of revolvers you reviewed for the series, would you combine into your best ww1 revolver.

Daniel Falch

In a previous Q&A, I asked the question who had the facial hair crown: Ian, Othais, or Rob. Rob was declared the winner. Now that Rob has been crowned Most Dapper, and you have seen that stache in person... how magnificent is it?

Chairman

How many Finnish guns do you have in your collection?

TJ

Looking forward from WW1, are there any (or maybe just a top couple) firearms that you would take into WW2? I was just thinking of the massive changes leading up to the Great War and the two decades of time for more changes before the next big one.

Nicholas Resar

How many Carolinas are too many?

David Poyner

What is the time line for you to produce an episode? I love hearing about the process on the podcast but trying to pick out the timeline is confusing, I'm particularly interested in 2 specific parts: Time between getting the shooting footage and the Mae-versation; Time between finishing editing the episode and then it getting posted (which I realize us patrons do get it a week before everyone else).

Samuel Christiansen

What's your favourite historical Scandinavian (gun)? Greetings from a recently discharged (honourably) guardsman of His Majesty The King's Guard, Norway. Love the show :)

stenrod

First off I want to say thanks for the great work you guys are doing for historical firearms. My question is a bit of a what if, but if you guys were dropped in 1910 Europe and for whatever reason had the resources to do it, what firearms would you start designing to sell to the Entente and Central Powers respectfully?

Jim Smitty

If you were a third party arming a revolutionary force during the WWI era (e.g. Irish, Czech or Soviet) and you had your pick of the world's weapons to choose from which would you pick and what factors would contribute to that choice?

Oisin Creaner

Someone already kind of asked my question. In the repercussion series are you planning to cover rifles? Like possibly unique ones like the Hall Rifle, the Fergusson and the Burnside (as examples)?

Boomersparky

Based upon the fact that they began with a Patterson and moved forward to the Walker and have dropped tidbits about the Dragoon(s), I think the timeline is all about reproductions from the Paterson forward...

Bruce Brodnax

The revolver's days were numbered and they were decided upon a self-loading pistol, hence the almost decade of trials before settling on the m1911 in... 1911. The 44 Magnum would almost certainly have initially appealed, until they realized that the vast majority of troops would not be able to meet accuracy standards. Heck, that was so difficult with even the .45acp that they had to invent the .30 M1 Carbine!

Bruce Brodnax

6.5 Swedish, so pretty close siblings...

Bruce Brodnax

I think that while the interest may be there, the $ is not, and they focus on the classics because that's the show and diverting fund$ to modern weapons will not bear fruit for them...

Bruce Brodnax

As Othais has lamented upon multiple occasions, he can no longer divulge what he's still looking for because there is a small but significant number of collectors who snap up the stuff he's looking for so they can be dogs in the manger & deny him access. I know, stupid right? But there it is...

Bruce Brodnax

They look better on parade. Also, they're going to have any blackening worn off in the regular process of maintenance, so why fight it?

Bruce Brodnax

More importantly, does S&W still have an inventory of serials #s for the #3s that were never paid for? My understanding is that Russia considers these antiques to be "treasures of national heritage" & forbids their export; it would be really cool if there was a reference so that if you managed to uncover one, you could demand payment [in gold, as per the original contract!] or repossess it. Heh!

Bruce Brodnax

Old load data is found in old reloading manuals [which is why some people collect the old ones that people throw out.] There's a couple of books about cartridge conversions [ie: "Start w/ this brass & do this..."] out there, but no, there is no site or book that has it all conveniently gathered in one place.

Bruce Brodnax

Many of the rifles seen in the decades leading up to WWI had elaborately curved buttplates. It seems this practice stopped, both in military and commercial guns, in the late 1800s/early 1900s. What caused this change to occur?

Matt Haught

While not likely to appear on the show I was wondering why the Farquhar-hill semi auto rifle despite being kinda adopted late in ww1 was designed around its own drum magazine and not the SMLE mag, was it an issue of reliable feeding with .303 from a box mag or something else?

Otto Eastwood

What historical figure, designer, engineer, officer, etc. has your opinion changed about the most after you learned more about them during your research? (IE, someone you thought was an idiot but learned to respect, or someone you thought was just great but turned out to be a total monster?)

DamageReport

what cartridges have you enjoyed shooting the most for the show? (pistol and rifle)

stephen larson

How do you determine if a book is reliable or not? I've been researching Beretta, which isn't exactly unknown, and I came across the dreaded RL Wilson. So needless to say, I didn't buy that book. I've been translating "better" ones from Italian. How do I know they're any good, though? I think of the struggle you've had with researching revolver history and evolution. I figure if we patrons can take this advice and get better resources, perhaps it would be able to better help you as well as we likely all have our specialties and favorites.

Philip Spadano

How did the whites and reds supply/source ammunition during the Russian Civil War?

Jeff King

When the shotgun series kicks off, can we get Clifton hicks on another podcast? If he comes on, push him for more of his gun passion.

Jon Bachmann

Given Othias is now a bit of an expert on revolvers, how have they changed over the past century since most of the ones featured on this show were made? Has there been innovation on their mechanisms or are they just mixing and matching older design elements?

13th Bee

For all the praise 7x57 Mauser has gotten over the decades from shooters, myself included, why did 7mm cartridges never really take off for military use outside of that?

Alexander Christian

Is the reprocussion series more or less difficult to produce? Or just different? And how far back do you plan on going? Are we going to see a blunderbuss at some point?

Gerald Drake

A hypothetical. In order to get back in the black for the show, you decide to take up the grand southern tradition of (amateur) professional wrestling. Between Othais and Mae, who's the manager, who's in the ring, and what's your gimmick?

Jake Rutten

The simulation has ended, you are in Purgatory, and as part of the (relatively minor) penance you have to pay to earn entry into the Metaverse, big cushy headphones are going to be glued to your head so you can judge other content creators. If you were forced to choose between podcasts, would you choose Lex Fridman or Joe Rogan?

James McKenzie

Don't have a question but do want to say I love your channel and to keep up the good work

Joshua Millward

After watching your show. I realized how much I love the history of firearms. Thank you for all your hard work preserving the history and artifacts. Okay here is the question. After I acquired my first several MilSurps I placed the ammo in a line up with some modern popular rounds. Would you agree that ammo in general has stagnated when compared to the shapes our for father developed during WW1? For example lining up 6.5 carcono, 8mm Mauser, .223/5.56, 7.65x39, and some that are still used in militaries around the world 7.65X54R and .50 Cal.

Mark Snow

I would love to know your opinions on commercial ammo or non m2 ball for the m1 garand - do you think it’s safe in a standard m1?

Will P

What cartridges do you think are underappreciated by shooters and collectors? One sporting and one military.

Sleepy's good boy

Now that you have pooped all over the pederson device other than a new receiver do you think anything could be done to make it 1919 reliable?

Will Wooten

Soup like life or life like soup?

Jason Guest

Have you ever seen a commie drink a glass of water?

General Jack Ripper

Who's the most underrated small-arms designer you've run across so far? The most overrated?

Matthew Jackson

It is just after the US civil war and you have the choice of a variety firearms to bring with you into the wilderness to make your living as a trapper/hunter. What rifle and pistol do you take, keeping in mind that metallic ammunition may be hard to procure.

Stephen

What if any WWI weapons could Australia have acquired on the surplus market that would have enabled them to win the Emu War?

Sean Tabor

Would you consider a firearm related book review series in future?

Tom Godwin

Joke question: Are Othais, Mae, and Suze a throuple? Serious question I actually want answered: What is your biggest what if design? Like which WWI era firearms design do you think would have been amazing if they had just iterated a bit more? For example, in the Ross episode, you talked about how amazing this armorer's normal-profile barrel, carbine-length ross would have been, but it never got traction. Mae please edit this question for concision. I'm exhausted from travel and can't think clearly

David Herman

Question for Q&A, What is Cut off date Pinner, Pre XX (Before that year) and Post XX (after that year) as I'm looking for into world war 2 weapons of big power and Weapons form 1920's and 1930's (Thompson Sub Machine Gun and all Section Machine guns-e.g Bren) Love your Work on Pinner and Repussain (Modern guns Which are build to 1840's patten).

James Mathieson

What are Othais ,Mae and tula's carry

Henry Case

Have you run across, during Mauser research, a translation of the script prefixes for serial numbers. Some of the letters are straight forward but several are difficult to determine. Along with this is there a particular resource that is the best place to identify production dates for Mauser rifles such as a Brazilian 1908. There are a lot of books out there and they tend to be quite expensive

Peter Nathaniel

Will there ever be a public video of Tula the Dog enjoying "being scared"?

Andrey Gardner

What type of keyboard and mouse do you prefer for your computer?

threelock

When will you do an episode on the Winchester Lee Model 1895?

Franz Anton Mesmer

I guess, I will ask you the classic WW1 question. As you sit in our trench with a clipboard taking an inventory of all the captured enemy weapons from a convoy we just hit with a slew of our own. When the great General Dumb Butt walks over. He says "May and Oathias, congratulations you're going over the top and raiding the enemy trench. Bring me back some intelligence, prisoners, or proof that the raid was successful" The enemy trench is 150 yards away, and sitting in this stockpile is every weapon you have laid hands on during your tenure on the show along with a plethora of Ammo. As you go over the top what weapon or weapons do you grab on your way to death or glory?

Tim Brintnall

After your successful campaign to get britishmuzzleloaders the Most Dapper Influencer award at the Gundies, can we expect to see any changes in your wardrobe going forward? As a more serious question, is there a reason we see gun manufacturers sticking with coil springs for operating the bolt instead of alternative kinds, like volute springs? I imagine this is a gross simplification of reality but I am pretty curious about it.

Ryland Swearinger

Despite my best efforts and being lubricated with adult beverages I can't come up with any funny question. So, Happy Easter to all you bunnies out there.

Markus B.

Going into WW1, lets say you're in one of the units in the reserves that's called into action. Which rifle that was relegated to the reserves by WW1 would you take and why?

Teku

For the Q&A: Thinking of all the weapons you’ve handled for the show, which ones are the worst (as in “I’d rather go into battle with a pointed stick then trust my life to that!”) and why? Answers for handguns and longarms please.

Michael 66

What is a Mcnugget buddy?

Bryan Sportel

Not a question, but a suggestion for you guys: Break up the Q&A into a couple, few episodes. It would stretch out the material and give you some more filler time between regular episodes. Maybe release them quarterly?

TankDestroyerSarge

Will we see any more content on your Keltec Sub 2000 or has that "thing" run it's course? Also what about the Trap series (shut up Kevin)? Has it been discontinued/terminated?

Josey

In your expert opinion, had the Smith & Wesson Model 29 and it's 44 magnum cartridge emerged during the time period of the early 20th century automatic pistol/revolver trials, would the US Army seriously considered choosing that over the 1911 given their obsession/paranoia over stopping power? Or was the revolver's days practically numbered in military service and they were going to choose an automatic regardless? Would they have concluded that 44 magnum was just too powerful to be practical as a military cartridge? Given the mania for stopping power, would they (the US Military) have tried to request Browning to make an automatic for the 44 magnum cartridge?

Royeaux

Considering pretty much every question is gun related, I figured this would change things up a bit. What are your favorite movies?

Cosmic Atrophy

Can you walk us through the process Bruno uses to model and animate the guns you feature--what software does he use, how does he capture the detail of the parts, is 3D scanning involved?

Albini family

Of all the inventors/developers of firearms in WW1, whom most do you believe was on the edge of a revolutionary achievement but fell short?

Paul Biedenbach

What gun do you regret having to say goodbye to the most?

Adam

Out of all the guntoobers you have interacted with, wich one was best/great to werk with? and why ain't it kevin.

Leslie Alexander

Out of the guns you’ve made primer videos for, what rifle or pistol (no machine guns) would you want for a “range toy” if it magically was gifted to you in a different cartridge? (For instance, I’d take a Comblain chambered in 7.62x54r)

Daikken

I remembered what I really wanted to ask. Do you think there is a way to educate and maybe even reproduce the Galilean sights? I know they aren’t practical but they are really cool and I think any Enfield collector would appreciate them

Nick Joppeck

What should be the fate of people who sporterized vintage rifles

Scott

You're given a time machine, but can only use it once (I.E. 1 full trip whenever and back again), how do you use it? Also, no time paradoxs, you cannot directly interfere with your own self, nor become your own grandpa.

GunsBeerFreedom

Based on comments made during Project Lightening it seems like one of the biggest shortcomings of the Chauchat was ergonomics and an extremely difficult sight picture to aquire. Considering this, why do you think the design was changed from the very ergonomic looking Chauchat-Sutter m1913 to the face-bruising contortion machine that is the csrg 1915? It seems like having the stock in-line with the receiver would have alleviated many of the comfort issues with the weapon and would have been relatively easy to accomplish with the 1915.

Joe Scholtes

Turning an action upside down (a al Maxim-Vickers) seems to be a thing in firearms development. Is there some inherent reason for this? For example, is the "right side up" version easier to develop incrementally and then once developed an engineer comes along with new eyes and says "Cool, but it would be even better upside down"? Or is it all just random?

Leonard Heinz

The time period which you focus on (end of the 19th and beginning of the 20th centuries) seems to be the most innovative and technologically significant in the history of firearms development, with advancements from black to smokeless, early repeating mechanisms to semi and full auto, and the shift to lighter, faster rounds, etc. Without having studied in detail all of firearms history, what do you think is the next most innovative and technologically significant period of advancement in firearms history? Thank you for your show and your commitment. You are the reason I finally got onto Patreon so everyone else I support (like Forgotten Weapons) owes you a debt as well!

AC C

From a purely aesthetics point of view what are your top guns you've covered so far on primer?

Ryan Brown

As much as you guys love living in the south, if you had to move to a northern state, where would it be?

Christian Hanes

What half dozen guns or so are top of the "I wish I could get my hands on it" list right now?

Nicholas White

First I want to thank the entire C&Rsenal crew. You all gave me the final push to get my MA in Museum Science (graduating in August). Now the Question: Having examined and researched 161 different firearms, What pieces of engineering stand out to you?

Daniel R.

I just wanted to know what is your most prized milsurp? The one that you immediately think of when someone, like me, asks what's your favorite/most proud of to own? Mine is my Argentine 1891. It's in fabulous condition and I love shooting it. The 7.65 cartridge feels so good to me.

Nick Siwak

Could you speculate on why so few WWI and interwar era firearms took advantage of ergonomic concepts like inline recoil to improve handling and performance. (I'm looking at you General Thompson.) It isn't like the human body and basic physics hadn't been studied.

Ron

Hello guys hope you are doing well, I have an interesting question for you guys, with how surprisingly early the German G88 commission rifle at its rimless 8mm cartridge was both designed and put into production I have always found it so strange that Germany had adopted a rimless cartridge so early, my question to you guys is had the G88 rifle fired a rimed 8mm cartridge do you think than when they got around to adopting Mauser 98 action would they would have also adopted 7mm Mauser cartridge or that experimental 6mm cartridge? Or do you think they would have done the same magazine trick that the Siamese Mauser's used just to keep the rimmed cartridge in service? And also what are the long term consequence for Germany and Mauser for either option.

fdxr

What are your thoughts on the combat viability of the Berthier machine rifle?

John Boy

Have you considered doing special episodes about things that you have touched on in individual primers but have never been able to cover in full. Such as say a complete biography of Ferdinand Mannlicher, the history of Remington or an account of the siege of Pleven. I’m sure you have lots of interesting details and stories that would be good to hear but won’t fit in any particular normal episode.

Alan Munro

Will you guys be doing a collab with Indy for World War Two like you did for the Great War?

Jacob Glassman

Othais, You are very good at figuring out and repairing old firearms. Are you self taught, or did you have some kind of training?

Randy Cannon

If shotguns in ww1 sucked when/why they came better in ww2 or did they?

eRahja

Serious question, more or less. Do you plan to go into flintlock for the Reprocussion playlist? I will happily watch a full episode on the wallgun we see Mae shoot in a short video.

Matteo Manino

Magical hypothetical scenario: would you rather have the French army in 1917 armed with nothing but Chauchats, or armed with nothing but RSC'Ss? There is no in-between for this scenario, it's one or the other

Orkevino

Silly question: Primer nr. 91, 38:11, any updates?

Matteo Manino

If you had to sit down with a future historian/collector born post 2000, and sum up the 20th century evolution of firearms design, but could only show them one gun to represent 100 years of development, which one would you choose?

Gyles Wiggins

Love your content and vids everyone!!! Not related to the Great War but what is your favorite small arm from the Cold War?

Luke Telling

What were some of the scariest moments of filming with older/refurbished firearms?

Veteran of the Mushroom Wars

While filming, we always, or almost always see a demonstration of the safety in action. Has a safety ever failed during a cut take and a round accidentally discharged, or has every safety worked every time?

Kanadian Kerbal

Given the legality of Flamethrowers in most states, will we ever see the history of something like the Wex or Flammenwerfer M.16? Or is that simply not in the cards due to it being unobtainable relatively speaking?

Reo

Can we see both your CCW and carry knives?

Jun Kumazawa

In the Swiss 1882 video, you talk about the 7.5x23mm being a man-stopper round. Do you think that's really true? Looking at the ballistics data for the round, it appears to be lobbing a relatively light bullet at low velocity. It's probably suitable for a police round, but it seems anemic for a combat round. It doesn't compare well to the 9x19mm, the .38 Special, the .45 ACP, or even the .455.

Hephaestus

Is there an unsung hero of the firearms industry you’d like to give a shout-out to, or who hasn’t received the recognition they deserve for creating something truly groundbreaking? We hear a lot about firearms designers of the past, but almost nothing about current day creators. Why do you think that is, and what might change it? (Snuck two questions in, please feel free to only answer the one you find more interesting.)

nick G

Hi Othais and Mae love the content keep up the great work. Out of the full power mainstay rifle cartridge of the late 19th century and throughout the 20th century which is your favorite? My personal choice is the 7mm mauser cartridge.

Sean S.

Given proper resources (budget, time, research help, etc.) are there any historical military subjects you would enjoy covering in the C&Rsenal style?

John M

We've seen the Keltec Sub2K and you've mentioned CCW, but other than that I haven't heard much mention of any newer guns on the market. Do either of you collect any more modern firearms, or do you even have any interest in the current new firearms market?

JustOldJoe

The M95 Mannlicher is often compared unfavorably to the Mausers and their derivatives in the context of The Great War, But I feel that it was actually a fairly strong contender in 1895 before the Mauser had gained dominance. So compared to its actual contemporary desighns Such as the 1891 Mosin, the long Lees with no chargers, the Gew 88, the French Lebel, and other designs of the period do you feel the M95 was a Good service rifle?

patrick mccurdy

No way, damn I love you guys. As for my 2 cents; the Mauser in one way or the other has been manufactured, what, into the 60s? When would you say the Mauser pattern was fully developed, when did the core idea transfer into a design idea?

Shaun Keckler

For Mae: maybe your Top 5 pistols of WWI hasn't changed. But do some of the awful ones seem a little less-bad after shooting some of the Reprocussion-series guns?

Brian Ingram

What has been your favorite Primer episode? Could be a fave because of a gun you always wanted to shoot/enjoy. Maybe fave because you uncovered some cool nugget during the research. Maybe fave because a place you had to go, or a process that had to be done to get what you needed for that episode.

Brian Ingram

Does the team at C&Rsenal find it a struggle or burden to remain so apolotical when current firearms content-- as well as the broader 'gun culture'-- has seemed to become so openly political in recent history? (My apologies if you disagree with the premise. Personally I lament how that strain of subject matter seems to be driving the firearms community today into a your-with-us-110% or you-are-lacking-credibility dichotomy.)

Atillite

You can use my name if you answer, thanks again!

Tim Black

I’ve just come back from Tombstone AZ , out there visiting family and I ran into a local Lions Club that is raffling off an 1873 Springfield Trapdoor. Since then I’ve been looking at everything I can find about that weapon. I’ve become a little obsessed with it. I’m retired Army Infantry heavy weapons and been collecting old military weapons for a few decades, well - more than a few. Do you have plans to produce an episode in the future on the Trapdoor Springfield? Your research and insight are highly valued by this old Grunt. Thank you for the opportunity to ask you about this awesome weapon!

Tim Black

Are there any rare rifles/pistols you'd still like to get your hands on for the Great War series? I'm thinking flieger carbines and stuff like that.

shawks

We know that 8mm Lebel was, dimensionally, one of the worst rifle cartridges. Did any handgun cartridges have similarly terrible dimensions but were kept in service for logistics' sake?

BumroyV2

What is your top five list for surplus bolt action rifles for recreational shooters on the balance of availability, relative cost/upkeep, and ammo availability? Outside of those factors, I love the M16 Berthier, the type 38 and 44 carbines, and the Vergueiro (in 8mm) for purely aesthetic readons but I don't know where any would place in your personal lists. Bonus, I know you mentioned who you THOUGHT made your black cap in the very first QA, Othias, but I cannot make it out and the YT captions are no help. Mind helping me out there?

Eric Meyer

Has Primer, Reprocussion and the It's a Trap make you appreciate more modern firearms or is it a case of nothing new under the sun?

Damien

If a strategically significant quantity of small bore intermediate ammunition suddenly appeared in ww1. How would the various powers try and use it? I would assume none of them would jump to a fully conceptualized assault rifle. What sort of weird and wonderful things would they come up with.

Primarch359

How r your motorcycles doing? Repercussion colts only or others, too? Shotgun series still comming?

Guido Schriewer

Did John Browning and Hiram Maxim every meet and/or work together?

Edward Booth

Related to Reprocussion, have you found any evidence to believe that any old percussion firearms snuck into ww1? Possibly in some random rear line home guard or something like that.

History&Coffee

What was the most annoying/tedious gun to get ready to shoot

Story Rogin

How many more firearms do you still have in your backlog for World War 1 that you can confirm were issued to troops?

Alexander Moore

With all of the single shots, or the rare repeating conversations there from, you've handled though the series, what was the best based off of handling (Mae) and the best for mass issue (Beardy)?

Will Sanders

You are working for the turn of the century Elbonia (see Forgotten Weapons Q/A) government. What bolt action rifle would you supply the troops (to sabotage them)?

Nathaniel Wright

How has each of your personal enjoyment in creating Primer changed as you have moved away from a strictly Great War series to a more generalized series?

Jacob Catcher

Why are some bolts left in the white? Like mosin nagant, SKS, and some yugo AK's have unfinished bolts, but the rest of the gun is finished. Is it truly unfinished, is it a different kind of metal that is more resilient to corrosion, or is there some other kind of treatment to it? I seem to remember some German rifles having bolts in the white for WW1, but were then finished during refurbishment post war? I've never been able to get a satisfactory answer to this question!

Tim Williams

Why do so many (mostly older) printed sources highlight the claim that Smith & Wesson nearly went bankrupt producing No. 3 revolvers for the Russian Empire due to Russian crookedness while reputable contemporary sources (such as Forgotten Weapons and C&Rsenal) don't mention this at all? If false, where did this myth come from?

Timothy Conklin

Is there a database or book for reloading cartridges that are no longer around? How do you go about finding load data?

Powers

Any chance of a collab with Drachinifel?

James Norlin


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