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Mrs. Doubtfire and Subtle Elite Paternalism

Saturday Night, after our early exit from LCD Soundsystem, Marilyn and I came home to find Millie and our babysitter watching the last half of Mrs. Doubtfire. I sat with Millie and watched the rest of the movie with her. I can't remember the last time I saw it. I may have only seen it once when it originally was released in 1993. Would I have seen it in the movie theater? No, probably not. I reckon my family would have rented it from Blockbuster.

I do remember it's cultural impact though. Beyond a silly farce that found Robin Williams at the zenith of his mass appeal, I remember it striking a chord in mass culture as it dealt with the idea of divorce and custody, single dads and the different ways families could exist outside the traditional nuclear model. Wrapped up in its slapstick silliness and Howard Shore's sweeter than sugar score was a message coming down from on high (20th Century Fox) steering hearts and minds around the water coolers. It wasn't as blatant as an Instagram post from Robin and Sally Field explicitly calling for a rethinking of family structure but it served the same purpose. In fact it was much more clever and effective. Mrs. Doubtfire wasn't alone of course. Hollywood regularly pumped out films and tv shows that set the tone for culture, morals and values, masked in digestible and entertaining packages.

Watching Mrs. Doubtfire certified a feeling I've had since the election: All of that's over. It's dead. Celebrities don't matter because the citizenry is sick of hearing from them. It's been dying for years and it will kick around for a while I guess, like The Penguin's mother (spoiler).

That's not to say people don't want entertainment. They just don't really care what the people making the entertainment thinks about anything outside of the entertainment they're making. Jimmy Kimmel, Bruce Springsteen, Beyonce, Taylor, Howard Stern, LeBron James... Shut up and dance for us.

This is painfully obvious isn't it? It's a message I've been hearing online for a while... stick to comedy. But we'll get to me later.

From the beginning, our airwaves and movie theaters have always sought to drive and guide culture. Early on it preached conformity and traditional morality (with some exceptions) - but when the boomers came of age and started taking control of the messaging, their idealistic activism of the 60s drove them to inject their ideology into the work - Live Aid, We Are The World etc... But for better or for worse, the internet and social media democratized and flattened out voices of influence and the folks at the top lost their dominant hold on it. Adam Curtis's multi part "Can't Get You Out of My Head" series does a great job of unpacking all of this.

I don't have the data to prove it, but my gut tells me that the collective approach of famous people making direct pitches for Harris had a net negative effect. I think it may have been smarter strategically to just ask Oprah and Bruce and everyone else to sit this one out. I don't think any of them, certainly not me, came from a cynical, craven or selfish place of doing it for the $$$ or because they were compelled to by some Deep State Cabal... no, I think everyone's coming from a righteous, place. But it's paternalistic attitude that, while not intended to be ends up feeling arrogant and elitist. It ends up feeling like "shhh, now now, I know what's best for you." I never thought of myself in the Oprah and Bruce camp, and when I used my voice to advocate for stuff, I always thought I was just doing it as me, the dude who's always cared about it, but now as hundreds of thousands of people paying attention to me. Naturally, most of those people didn't give a fuck what I thought. They just wanted a quick laugh.

Of course, this isn't the only reason I think Trump won, but once I started thinking about it, it kind of unraveled into a self examination of everything I do creatively. At it's core, it all comes from a place of subtle elite paternalism. My comedy, especially the more satirical stuff begins with me having a point of view, deciding something is wrong, stupid or absurd and then finding creative ways to reflect that back to you the audience. It works best when the audience agrees with the point of view. It confirms something to be true about the world that they've sensed already. I don't know if it's a bad thing. I think the idea of Elitism has gotten a bad rap actually! It's a slur now, but don't we need some hierarchy of ideas? We need people smarter than me and you to push things forward. Progress for chrissakes!

But then again, I start thinking: maybe I don't know shit?

Anyway, I'm grateful to as least have this as a new thought bouncing around in my head. It's not going to drive me into comedy retirement, but I think it will have an impact. It'll act as a little governor, the idea of subtle elite paternalism... how overt is it? how much is it driving the idea... Who or what are my targets? How can it be less smug while still interesting?

With all that said... how about Matt Gaetz's weird ass face, eh?

P&L, T

 

 

Comments

anybody want to talk doubtfire or williams?

Chalameybe

In the middle of this I forgot I was on in some back corner room of patreon and I thought I was reading a full fledged New Yorker piece. Well said.

Shane Stevens

All fair. I'm in a bubble. A lot of people working 2 or more days a week from home, with plump 401ks, super low unemployment, traveling at an all time high, driving $75,000 SUVs and complaining about $5 eggs.

Jeff Franchetti

thank you!

Tim Heidecker

I say this with all love and respect, T, but lumping all "celebrities" together is shortsighted. That's a massive spectrum, from billionaires like Oprah to more niche celebrities like yourself and many of the people you have on Office Hours. I agree that no one wants to hear Oprah pretending to know what it's like to be the common man. But I don't think you're completely removed from the economic realities that your fans face. You're not so rich that you live in a fantasy world and sit around thinking about estate taxes for your heirs. People aren't stupid. They know that when you join, say, a picket line, you are far closer to the striking workers than the billionaire CEOs they're fighting against. This matters...a lot! IMO, we need people like you more than ever. I hate to use the word "safe space," but that's what it is. We know that when we sign on to Office Hours Live, we can expect empathy with all the bullshit going on in the world. Not talking about it just normalizes it and makes those affected by it feel like they're fighting alone. Not saying you should spend twenty minutes a show talking on your soap box, but ignoring it isn't helping anyone. For instance, it seems like there's a lot of LGBTQ+ members of the Office Hours family and I'm sure they feel emboldened by your continued support. I know you've also publicly stated your opinions on Gaza and that matters a lot. We can't bring enough attention to these issues and, speaking for myself here, I don't find it disingenuous at all. You're a genuinely good person and you surround yourself with other genuinely good people. Office Hours is a hell of a community, and I think we'll need each other a lot over the coming years. No more bullshit!!

Sean

What are Trump, Elon and RFK Jr, if not celebrities? I think everyone is still grieving and processing everything. There will be lots of buyer's remorse as things get worse and more ridiculous. Keep doing what you're doing.

FerntFernt

You're not speaking to a Trump supporter so you'd have to ask them. But as many have said, at the very least, they offered (albeit complete bullshit) solutions to the struggles of the working class. The dems really didn't even acknowledge the fact that most people are struggling. Their answer to Trump's "we're going to cut taxes and impose tariffs to give people a break" (bullshit, obviously) was "vote for Kamala because Taylor Swift said so" all while running an insanely unpopular center-right campaign akin to Nikki Haley. All in all, the Trump team didn't lean on endorsements the way Kamala did. He leaned on the fact that he's charismatic and people are upset. Common fascist trope obviously, but people have a right to be upset. Kamala was a charismatic black hole and basically patronized people who were upset.

albrechto

How did Taylor, Oprah, Bruce not hear you more than Kid Rock, Hulk Hogan, Dana White, Rob Schinder and James Woods? Is there less caring on their part? Less giving? Less willingness to do what's right?

Jeff Franchetti

I think the difference between you and say, Taylor, is that there is a conceited effort to work and hear what us "common folk" think as well. I think the problem, (as someone who lives in a swing state) is when you trot out the likes of Taylor, Oprah, Bruce, etc. is they are so divorced from normal everyday life, that it can never resonate with a working class person from middle America. Shut up and dance, sure. But if you want to be heard as an "elite" you also have to hear us. The struggles of the working class have fallen upon deaf ears of the neoliberal elite.

albrechto

Hey Tim, love your work and enjoyed seeing you and the VGB at that weird church venue in DC. Anyway, I respect the idea to take a step back to re-evaluate but really appreciate how you push your humor with different approaches whether it's On Cinema, Beef House, or Office Hours. I don't think of it as an "elitist" type of humor, which is only interested in talking "at" me, but instead elevated or high concept. In that regard, I actually think theres way more of a humanistic/respectful dialogue in your stuff than say, a KillTony who from my observation, only seems to be talking at his audience with his preconceived stereotypes, LCD humor. One other point that's likely already been made is, if you're an elite than what is Elon Musk or half the people that fund the other guy's campaign? I just think the elite stuff and being annoyed at Bruce may be a little overdetermined in what may or may not have swayed people one way or another. All of this is to say, please take a break by all means but you're a singular, inspiring voice among the flotsam and it's really da best. Take it easy!

Michael Lieberman

What you said about elitism reminds me of the Pavement episode of OHL where Malkmus talked about how Michael Stipe doesn’t mind being called an elitist because he’d rather hang out with other likeminded people. I’ve been thinking about that philosophy on elitism since I heard it. There is most definitely a hierarchy of ideas and it’s ridiculous that some would prefer that we pretend there isn’t. Seems like “elitism” as a pejorative is losing its actual meaning, especially when it feels like everyone and everything gets accused of being elitist now.

Reeves

as a child of divorce, this movie always creeped me out. robins character is unhinged and manipulative.

Shana Johnson

Thank you for sharing this introspection with us. I think what has always differentiated you as a creative comedy innovator is two of the elements you called out… “subtlety” and “creatively reflecting [a point of view] back to the audience.” I think the subtlety is why a lot of people without creative roots don’t always “get” the deeper criticisms of society and consumerism your work is pointing out, because they can’t get past the weirdly absurdist and creative elements. Anyway, your work has always had a deep impact on me and helped me process the shitty parts of American culture in a way that made me feel like other people understand how fucked up things can be, especially in a time when everything had a reality tv veneer about it.

Jim Schroeder

Great post.

Kris macfalda

Please keep making stuff that resonates with others who sense and feel the same things you highlight in your work. I think you said once in an interview that you make things that “make it easier to make sense of the world” or something along those lines. It’s good to have a little corner of this bonkers world to relate to. Isn’t everything that’s in existence subtly paternalist from the creators POV?

Barnador

I hate this post. How long are we going to have to wallow in self doubt? Feeling like we will no longer ever feel like we did before. If 2.5% (revised to 1.7%) of people voted differently, we would be watching a Bruce concert tonight at MSG instead of ultimate fighting. This is a temporary feeling. You can't see through it right now. But it is ok to be a part of the educated and elite minority. Someone actually is the good guys here. Get back into the game.

Jeff Franchetti

Hey Tim, I think you’re one of the greats of threading the needle of addressing real pressing things while still 1) being really funny about it 2) keeping it out of the realm of preachiness. It’s all the more admirable that you’re concerned you aren’t pulling it off! Just my two cents as a big fan. Peace and Love

Jacob Kuddes

Tim you should read/listen to Inventing Reality by Michael Parenti

KD

Despite being nominally on the “same side”, I think your work has often served as the exact counterculture to the kind of slick mass culture that produces celebrity endorsements. That could also help explain the tension here maybe.

qualiaa

What’s been so attractive about your work to a lot of people, I think, has always been subtly political—a shared feeling of immense alienation from mass culture that we are collectively forced to endure. Someone making pitch-perfect absurdist reinterpretations of it tells them they’re not alone in feeling alienated. When people said “stick to comedy” I think they actually agreed with the politics of your work on an intuitive level, and felt a disconnect when it was made explicit & put into terms they’ve been trained to reject or ignore.

qualiaa

Thank you for linking the documentary, it is fascinating so far. I feel like the willingness to question our own behavior is a signal in itself that there is an earnest desire to move in a more constructive direction. Many celebrities seem to wield their fame in a way that they expect people to not only agree but follow their lead, and I've never really felt like the Trinity is guilty of that, but then again I may have personal bias as well. I look forward to these questions about motives being explored as real world examples continue to pop up. There will always be groups that feel "condescended to", but it seems to me that many of them feel that way because of their own insecurities and the refusal or inability to question their own decisions and actions. Hopefully out of the next 4 years something positive springs up and we can keep it alive for a while before the nation gets distracted. I look forward to the next show!

Jeff W

Great perspective. Totally agree that the implicit arrogance or elitism of mega celebs earnestly endorsing Kamala hurt. The common thinking is that most of these people are immoral adrenochrome drinkers, or out of touch elites at best. “Beyonce and Jay Z endorsed Harris!” gets quickly dismissed and spun to the negative; “They would—probably eat babies together. She only cares about rich people anyways.”

David Edwards

I appreciate this take on "influencers" today. I agree that some kid on YouTube will have more influence than Oprah. What is becoming increasingly clear to me in my little part of the world is that something like misogyny is a very strong force in the U.S. today. I look at Canada and think, “that’s how we should be,” I know they aren’t perfect. I believe the races have come together under trump via the galvanizing effect of misogyny. I moved from the Bay Area to Merced Ca about 10 years ago. So, a lot of the weird shit I see and hear has felt like a regional thing. People are generally incredibly nice here, however the attitude of a woman’s place is in the home has become more outspoken, especially since the election. I think trump winning has emboldened the voices further. For example, I’m taking some college classes, and several men have openly said that women ought to be inside taking care of the house while men take care of the yard, etc. One man said that if he found his wife outside with a shovel, he’d take it from her and send her in the house. He followed that by saying, “you can hate me if you want.” I’ve heard women in these classes agree. One woman said she’s never put gas in her car and she’s no spring chicken. I am shocked by all this. I grew up with 8 brothers and a dad who encouraged me to cross those men only boundaries. I’ve learned to operate numerous power tools and do most handyman things myself, save some of the more daunting plumbing issues (I did install an irrigation system in my front and backyard solo and I’ve installed new toilets). With youtube and all the tools available nowadays it’s totally doable. Most importantly I love doing it, I hate dusting and vacuuming. Why deny a little girl the opportunity to learn whatever she wants? I’m frankly scared by these attitudes and felt we were really getting beyond all that. I think this all relates though my focus is a little off to the sides.

Mary Newman

With regard to this topic, I always think of this Vonnegut quote: "During the Vietnam War... every respectable artist in this country was against the war. It was like a laser beam. We were all aimed in the same direction. The power of this weapon turns out to be that of a custard pie dropped from a stepladder six feet high."

Painthuffer2

Sorry, I know this is a tangent from where the post actually went, but this one hits a nerve... "After a bitter divorce, an actor disguises himself as a female housekeeper to spend time with his children held in custody by his former wife." I'd say that film was actually quite damaging in that it portrayed a "sugar sweet" take on the actual hell you go through if you're deemed the non custodial father and there's a scornful mother standing between you and seeing your kids. As a father, you are often, by default, treated - with total unfairness or basis in fact - like a worthless criminal in these situations. This film darkly mirrors it, and it's not funny. The family court system in this country is and has been profoundly broken. It upholds that "nuclear model" and "traditional" gender roles. If you know, you know.

rainbowdark

It’s seems like the issue with celebrity statements is similar to a lot of the pundits. They just aren’t in touch with real life or normal people. The identity politics and victim-mentality just drives moderate voters away, and most of the country are moderate voters. Keep up the good work, guys. I still get a chuckle out of the Trump drops and don’t mind some political talk. The trinity does a great job of moving on to other topics so it doesn’t feel excessive to me.

Goose

I think you should continue to satirize and speak out but ultimately politics isn't a cultural battle that can be won with better movies or music or podcasts. Despite what a lot of liberal pundits are saying, they didn't lose this election because of a messaging problem.

WL

just this morning, I went to a workshop where an experienced storyteller taught the importance of moving things along in a spoken story to keep your audience's attention. I see how you do that on OHL. So I appreciate you taking the time out, every week, to slow things down with us in your written words. Especially when the topic is this serious and requires thought. Examining why one creates something is, to me, akin to identifying reasons for artistic existence. there's not an easy answer, especially for someone like you. true, you are just one person, but, as you observed, the stories from said people can change a culture, bit by bit. and you have a LOT of storytelling power. At the workshop, I couldn't help but think of your Leather Jacket Guy as the storyteller bellowed across the room, and I kind of missed the guy. Then the space seemed to shrink in the next instant as the storyteller's tiny voice wavered, and I wondered what else we would see with your wide range. You put a lot of thought into your work. Take the time you need. I look forward to whatever you create, loud or soft.

lilula9

I think you are right, I like your views and thoughts and it is definitely part of your comedy and I think that influences culture enough. I was starting to cringe at all the Democratic celebrity stuff. I live in TN and none of that celebrity stuff moves the needle, but there are issues that Democrats could definitely tackle that would. They bumped the “Tennessee 3” from speaking at the DNC due to a performance by Pink I think, and the downvote in TN is so important but the DNC thought a pop performance was better. Probably didn’t matter at the end of the day but I thought it was a bad move. Anyway I know when I go to a Tim and Eric show or go see Radiohead, or a comedy bang bang show that people will generally be kind and sorta liberal and progressive and that matters.

Wendy Rancier

I'd strongly recommend, for anyone who is interested in some of the actual reasons Harris lost and what has happened to the Democratic party over the last few decades, the book Listen, Liberal.

Niall Johnson-Byrne

I think it shows how much the Democratic Party is invested in culture wars. They are an extreme opposite of the Republicans, in that they virtue signal moral superiority around cultural societal issues, instead of focusing on populist economic issues that most people agree with : healthcare for all, anti-war, etc. by over-investing in the muddy culture wars that Republicans instigate, the democrats come off as pompous people that are more interested in tertiary (though important) social issues.

Des L

There is a massive culture of anti-intellectualism. A lot of us regular folks are just trying to survive. COVID, inflation, a genocide being live streamed without consequences... It's hard to listen to "the elites" because they're funding the whole thing. BUT there are still lots of people who want their entertainment to be meaningful. It wasn't the political messaging of Mrs Doubtfire that got us, it was the humanity. That's what good art is all about, especially comedy. That's what can change hearts. It can be explicit or it can be abstract & subtle, told through allegory/metaphor/gesture. Sometimes a person's presence is enough to have an impact because it is a person who belongs to social groups that never get airtime. We love relating, we crave it. We love when our celebrities are humans, we can't get enough of it. I think Awesome Show had a lot of messages about humanity but they're coming from a place of... The subconscious? Yeah I reckon. Absurdism is a good salve in these times. From Dada, Flux Manifesto, Monty Python and all that. I dunno T, please keep doing what you're doing, please. Don't let the bastards bring you down

Di Drew

I’ve been thinking about this a lot too. It feels like if these artists are donating their time to perform at a rally to help drive attendance at or to volunteer and engage with voters has more of an impact than just making a post or video for Instagram. Maybe the performances or volunteering aren’t changing as many minds but the time donation seems more real than the social media posts, which in a lot of cases confirm what you already know. Of course Springsteen did both performance and social media support, but I think celebrities posting that they voted and who they voted for on the day of the election really doesn’t have an impact on anything but their own public image.

Sara L

haha

Tim Heidecker

mostly agree that celebs are unhelpful, but man g clooney really did us a solid this cycle

skeletonmeat

Daddy Done Did It Again! Love to you and all the OHL community

dj bvckwoods

Yea I like to know who is behind the art I consume and their beliefs and intentions, whether they’re morally sound by my judgement, but I don’t really need them to state their beliefs or explain themselves. Actions speak louder than words and art speaks for itself. I’m always skeptical of anyone claiming they are a-political, for me that’s a red flag and I’ll probably tune them out or view everything they make with even more skepticism. Your work makes me laugh (edit: laugh and think and cringe, etc., and on cinema is comfort food for me at this point with how often I rewatch it), I don’t expect moral perfection or superiority from you or anyone, and every creation is a collaboration anyway

Ornico (katie)

I agree it’s a hard moment economically to listen to celebrities’ gospel, but also think there’s more to it. There’s like this cultural moment where there is deep resentment toward others’ joy. In my experience listening to others share that they don’t hold the same standard toward Musk, Trump, et al. They’re either happy to listen to them or are indifferent as opposed to some resentment they feel toward Springsteen, Oprah, et al. I think because deep down they have this deep type of feeling toward them because they’re making art or culture, which seems so out of reach to us as AI and STEM and LinkedIn assholes get shoved down our throat. I think people find Musk and Trump’s miserableness relatable and a piece of reaching economic prosperity. Always appreciate you sharing your thoughts, Tim

shy alaskan

It’s a raincheck on pain (says David Bowie)

Stu Walker

I think a solution for the future of Tim’s quandary is to do collaborative work with John Early who is able to poetically balance empathy with generational existential dread and hopelessness with mainstream culture’s pull to escape the dread with vacuous celebrity. Also, Tim, a read of Ernest Becker’s The Denial Of Death may help wrestle with the malaise in the USA. It helped me make sense of it all.

Stu Walker

I do think the celebrity endorsements were in such poor taste. I agree with Bernie that the Dems have left the working class behind. When there is no mention of health care for all, student loan forgiveness, the enormous and ever-growing wealth gap, etc., the average person does not care what celebrities like Katy Perry or Jay Z, who have become global brands at this point, have to say about politics. They will be fine no matter who is president because wealth safeguards no matter who you are (rich people will always be able to access abortion). When you pair that will Harris's abysmal track record as a prosecutor, and the fact that Roe could have been salvaged under Biden/Harris and wasn't, everything the Dems say seem hollow. I'm in law school, and we learn so much about how the criminal justice system has just replaced old Jim Crow laws and also has virtually criminalized poverty in a lot of ways (making sleeping in public a crime, probation violations that relate more to addiction, which correlates with poverty for many reasons, than criminality, etc.). At the end of the day, pushing someone as out of touch and right-leaning as Harris, who was not even chosen by us to be the candidate, was perhaps the most absurd strategy imaginable. Celebrity endorsements just fueled this distance between her and the average voter.

Samantha E Salter

Even weirder than Matt Gaetz's face are the people who vote for an authoritarian they know from a TV show while making a point to announce that "celebrities should stop telling people how to vote"

Tom

So is Joe Rogan

Stu Walker

As much as some people may be genuinely smart and have better ideas than the "hoi polloi", it is folly to suppose that *that*, in and of itself, means that those smarter people will not act in their own individual self-interest, and that the smart people in power will not act in the interest of the class to whom they are indebted for their power. I'm not saying that elites always only act cynically and according to base self-interest---to borrow a formulation from a brilliant political science professor (Adolph Reed jr.), it is the role of ideology to harmonize the beliefs and ideals you want to hold with what advances your material interest. Since the inception of hierarchical societies, elites everywhere have told innumerable stories about why it is natural, right, and good for them to be at the top; and why what is good for them is actually good for everybody. And in general, the rest of society has bought into those stories and taken them as true accounts of things, according to the ability of the ruling class to deliver enough stuff to enough people to secure widespread buy-in (again borrowing a formulation from Reed). Maybe in the '90s, enough people believed that neoliberal capitalism provides the means for anybody to prosper and flourish, that people were more willing to take direction from elites. It was the post-Cold War boom times, the fall of the USSR seemed to indicate that neoliberal capitalist order was the only game in town, and the overall ideological consensus was far to the right of where it had been two or three decades earlier ( Clinton was, after all, basically just Reagan Lite). An alarming number of people were on board with the notion that anyone who wasn't doing well in American society was suffering primarily, if not entirely, from the consequences of their own moral failures. The prevailing "underclass" ideology (very well studied by Reed and his students/collaborators) lay behind broad acceptance of the '94 crime bill and welfare "reform" (gutting and decimation, really). A lot of people, even amongst the impoverished and working people themselves, were willing to accept that basically anybody who wasn't moving up under neoliberal capitalism was a degenerate lowlife, in need of quite intensive paternalistic intervention (the bleeding-heart Liberal position), if they could even be redeemed (the right-wingers doubted it). In any event, these days, I'd say that peoples' sense that they can prosper under neoliberal capitalist order has evaporated quite significantly, and not a lot of people are willing to by into the ideological stories about why the world we live in is the best one possible, and why the present rulers deserve their power. Sanders probably isn't going to spearhead a challenge to the Democrats from the Left again. We had better hope that we can get something along those lines together just through some good old fashioned boots-on-the-ground organizing. If Sanders's coattails were truly the only thing that gave anyone the drive and energy to organize beyond just trying to get him elected, well... it may well be, only a God can save us now.

Lee Borocz-Johnson

The data proving your gut instinct is Harris losing the popular vote

Andy B

I think there's a lot of people in this country who are being exploited every day. "What does it matter who I vote for," they might think, "if I still have to wake up and go into my crappy retail job again?" People want CHANGE. They want to own a house, have a car that doesn't break down, and for their tax money to be used for their sake. Kamala couldn't articulate actual change she would bring. I think if a celebrity railed against Hollywood, how executives spend millions on a movie they don't release only to get a tax break, for example, it would resonate. But I don't think that message or that type of message was really sent. It feels like corporate overlords fighting for power with people as pawns. Anyway, thank you for your thoughtful message, Tim. Maybe goof on the Schlang C-suite next? Maybe bring us into the Schlang cinematic universe?

Doctor Tony

But Trump was a rich celebrity to begin with. Now there is a head scratcher 🤯

Joss Humberstone

My thoughts also. If the home lives were in a better spot, I believe the outcome would be different

TheReal007

I think it’s a particularly hard moment for the average person who might be struggling to make ends meet to hear from celebrities who they perceive to be more or less exempt from the same pressure. It’s really not entirely true in an environment where many working actors, musicians, etc are questioning whether they can continue in this line of work when so much of the money has dried up. Still, to a lot of people, if they’ve seen you in tv or movies or bought one of your CD’s there’s this idea the person must therefore be financially secure. I also think social media has contributed to a mass demystifying of celebrity. Celebs are often shockingly accessible these days, and even if they don’t directly respond to fans, they share more of their lives often in a way that works against the glamour and mystique. So they become mere mortals, just people working a job, and so why should I care any more about their opinion than anyone else? It then becomes incredibly cringey to see things like that Avengers Zoom call. This is all stuff that’s been explored by Bret Easton Ellis around a decade ago with his idea of Empire and Post-Empire (a cultural notion more than a political one). The era of limited access to the means of media production, cultural gatekeepers and low audience input - that’s all long gone, for better and for worse. Anyway I really admire Tim’s transparency here and his grappling with tough questions in front of the audience. I think there will be a time when a new form of activism even among the famous will be able to read as genuine again but for now it seems wise for most to take a step back.

Casey

good point!

Tim Heidecker

There's also the whole thing where people want to be reassured that their favorite artists share their political opinions and if you as an artist decline to share a political stance you're going to potentially be blacklisted by this small group of people who, again, only want to hear you say what they already think. The window for influencing other people's feelings is just really short but it is there, at different times for different people. I dunno, I'm gonna go buy donuts.

Monique

thanks for this blog, Tim...i've been thinking about this a lot as well. i love the kind of comedy/satire you do, but share a certain helplessness seeing this fracturing of culture...these weird/pandering endorsements from mega-celebs that don't really seem to matter, or make things worse. fwiw, your comedy has always made me feel less alone in an alienating cultural/political landscape, and helps me connect with a community of people & their values. maybe that's different from political "value" or action or whatever, but "No More Bullshit" (taken genuinely, not how that guy means it) is a net positive thing to put out there, i think, and sort of mobilizes people to not put up with how stupid everything is. idk. if you can laugh at it you can work toward rejecting it to build something better—i thought about this a lot with your Rogan spoof. everything you're saying here is worth talking/thinking more about. hope you're doing well amid it all...eagerly awaiting new On Cinema!

Chloe Lizotte

Fame only exists in the mind

brainblob

Damn

Caleb

Tim I didn’t get a chance to watch live but I also was plagued with a nostril pimple this week.

Steven krieger


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